#my experiences with the fandom and its discourse put me off it like. yeah actually i dont want to be involved with any of this | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

darlington-v · 3 years ago

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I know different interpretations of a work are generally enriching and cool... but c!dream villan interpretations is like how to tell me you only watch Tommy without saying you only watch tommy.... which would be fine but its not a great place to be making statements about the whole nature of the dsmp lol

Wild speculation, but sometimes I wonder if like, because the dsmp didn't really start as a narrative, and a lot of fans don't nessecarily enter it expecting a narrative, but then there is one and the fandom is really discourse heavy and everyone is sort of excpeted to have an opinion while maybe not expecting to form one from the begining or not having a ton of experience with narrative in a way that would "expect" them to have an opinion or not take things at face value??, I don't know if I explained that well at all... and I don't really even think thats right nessecarily... but like wow sometimes some of the takes about power and government and villany...

Honestly, it makes sense!!!

I think something interesting is like.... looking at how animatics have shaped the like tone and culture of the fandom essentially. Like, an interesting fact that I didn't really fully grasp until SUPER recently is like...

c!Wilbur out the gate admits he is manipulating c!Tommy. Like his first youtube video on the Dream SMP he admits his goal is to manipulate c!Tommy and people like c!Tommy into helping him achieve a potion ("drug") empire to monopolize on potions because there were a lot of people on the server who like to min-max, which is to put all of your effort into this one specific skill essentially. so like... i know minecraft doesnt have a skill tree but if it did, it would be putting all your points into that one specific branch of a skill tree. So he wanted to exploit the labor of all the TommyInnits to.... maintain a Potion Empire.

THIS IS A LONG POST BC I GOT CARRIED AWAY SO BUCKLE UP

And I don't think a lot of the fandom who joined later on knows this. I certainly didn't until like a week or so ago? Like... I knew c!Wilbur had been manipulative from the start because I'm a mod of (shameless self promo incoming) @dsmpanalysis and we have a lot of different POVs in that mod team and discord and we talk about it really frequently. I joined the fandom as someone who was really big on L'manburg ESPECIALLY crimeboys, and have turned into.... *gestures vaguely to my blog*

And ngl I owe a lot of it to @1-michibiki-1 in terms of c!Dream "Apologism" but all of the mods there have expanded my thoughts and views on the storylines of this narrative.

My application consisted of like largely essays about like... how I think Dream was the villain but he was meant to be the villain because you don't get any insight into his character WHICH.... IS A FAIR ASSUMPTION AT FIRST GLANCE. People are easily villainized when you cannot get a glimpse into their thought process. It's easy to dwindle someone down into this flat character and starting out I knew Dream didn't stream the SMP on purpose.

And I personally came to the conclusion of "Oh! So Dream is supposed to be the villain." However as the story continued and I learned more about what Dream went through I began to realize that... it's more than likely a form of a red herring. My opinions on this were immediately solidified when I watched Ranboo's 2 MIL stream because both Ranboo AND Dream agree on enjoying red herrings.

There have been MANY times were Dream has said that c!Dream is a complex character and he's not a wholly evil guy and there have been times where the narrative has honestly just proved that.

Anyways, what's important though was that... I learned most of this from other people who were more focused on c!Dream rather than myself. Eventually I shifted from c!Tommy to c!Ranboo and c!Techno after c!Tommy betrayed c!Techno and I began to realize.... everything I learned before hopping in wasn't exactly what it seemed.

Part of this is because I'm older, I heavily identify with c!Techno's sense of loyalty and philosophies on government, but I especially identify with the anguish c!Techno voiced in... a lot of lore but especially the lore around Doomsday.

I'm not 16 anymore. I don't always feel wronged by adults, or older people in my case, whenever they absolutely have done something wrong by me, but I do feel wronged by my close friends. I also felt like c!Tommy's sense of loyalty didn't line up with mine after what felt like him constantly flip-flopping and refusing to understand c!Techno's morals on government didn't line up with his.

In short, it was easier to identify with Tommy in these animatics versus in the actual stream content because c!Tommy is played by a 16 year old. I'm not a teenager and my line of thinking doesn't entirely line up with people that age anymore. It's harder to place myself in the same shoes of someone's OC who is played closer to their actual age, because I'm not that age.

Regardless, I was still on the c!Dream is a villain train. I wasn't ever like... c!Dream is repulsive I hate him, but I was like omg hot villain lad go brrr.

Even when the first like... mellohi, panic room, Ranboo lore stream popped up I thought "Oh! c!Ranboo corruption arc?"

And I was excited because I really wanted this shy, nervous character to turn into villain buddies with his good pal c!Dream. I'm a total sucker for villains and corruption arcs and all that good shit.

SO I STARTED GETTING REALLY INTERESTED IN ENDERSMILE. I'VE BEEN ON ENDERSMILE SQUAD OUT THE GATE. NOT THE SAME WAY I AM NOW, BUT I'VE ALWAYS WANTED THEM TO TEAM UP.

So... upon not really keeping up with c!Dream and being relatively??? indifferent? I don't think I started arguments on c!Dream back then, but I might have. But I remember like... starting to participate more whenever c!Dream came up and looking more into Dream's character BUT ESPECIALLY TALKING WITH OUR SERVER'S C!DREAM SPECIALIST MICHI ABOUT DREAM A LOT MORE.

And because Michi has been a watcher since day one and was a DTeam fan rather than a SBI fan, she was able to provide me with more information on how the server worked pre-Tommy but especially pre-Wilbur.

Now, you could definitely argue well Michi probably has clear bias but it made sense to me when I looked back on how the storyline had been constructed and was going along, and everyone in the server talks a lot about our own biases and how we want people to maybe not lean so hard on them. Michi would also provide like anecdotes on what had happened and I'm sure links were probably provided at one point but the point was I felt like Michi had no reason to lie or manipulate how the story was told and if she did, eventually someone would have pointed it out because... Group of like... right now it's around 20 or more analysts but I don't remember how many at the time there were. POINT BEING, WE'VE ALL GOT POINTS TO PROVE AND IN MY EXPERIENCE NOT MANY OF US HAVE BEEN SHY TO PROVE THEM.

So if anyone ever had any differing opinions they would be talked about and we literally had and still have discussions.

REGARDLESS.... I DIDN'T FACT CHECK IN DEPTH BECAUSE I THOUGHT PEER REVIEW WAS ENOUGH WHEN YOU HAVE LIKE HOURS UPON HOURS OF STREAMS TO WATCH.

Anyways. Eventually I started paying closer attention and looking more into c!Dream lore but only recently have I started to triple check before speaking about c!Wilbur lore because I know everyone has biases and while I did trust everyone's thoughts and analysis in the discord, whenever I make essays I typically like it to be largely air tight and if theres a mistake, I want it to be because I forgot not because I just trusted what was said. Plus, I wanted to get down to the specifics of how Wilbur had always started with manipulation on the mind.

SO I WATCHED HIS FIRST VIDEO ON THE DREAM SMP.

AND WHAT I WAS NOT BY ANY MEANS EXPECTING WAS WILBUR TO SAY WORD FOR WORD, VERBATIM,

"SO WHY DON'T I START AN INDUSTRY WHERE I USE THE TOMMYINNITS OF THE WORLD TO WORK FOR ME, TO CREATE THINGS THAT THE MIN-MAXERS OF THE WORLD WILL WANT."

Like... this is in no way an attempt to like hardcore villainize c!Wilbur like everyone does Dream, it's just more so to like REALLY outline how far off a lot of fandom interpretation of c!Wilbur is....

Because of SBI focused animatics.

Now, when I joined I watched A LOT of animatics that really highlighted like... Wilbur being this self-loathing JD-esque, "I destroyed it because I had to because the world was against me because no one loved us, Tommy" type of character. At least... that's what it came across as.

And it definitely highlighted the fact that Tommy was a victim, which he is. He is undoubtedly a victim and no not even any dream apologist can change my mind otherwise. Tommy, despite being an instigator sometimes, didn't deserve the abuse he received.

But these animatics never shown the fact that c!Wilbur started L'manburg as a shady ploy to exploit people like c!Tommy and vilify c!Dream so he could have power.

And that was easy because Dream and Tommy had wars before. They had spars and pranks and here's the plan to take back my disks and here's the plan to out smart the thieving little child etc etc.

And all of the animatics I watched never mentioned this. Neither did the recaps though. The recaps gave the events flat out, there didn't sound like there was bias, and honestly I don't really know if there was rather than like... a lack of nuance. And it's hard to provide a recap with that much nuance in a short period of time for a youtube video, to be perfectly fair.

However, this creates a perfect formula for entirely rewriting the history of a server. c!Wilbur quite literally fucking succeeded TO A META LEVEL. He slandered and ran smear campaigns against Dream and like he even does that with Sapnap in the beginning. But what's crazy is that it transferred over into the meta! Most of this fandom understands Wilbur as a victim of mental illness, and yeah maybe? He definitely wasn't mentally well by the end of pogtopia, but he never started out with honorable intentions. L'manburg was never a victim, only its citizens. The TommyInnits of the world.

I just think it's like... such an interesting case study. Because this is like... an opinion like shared by at least half of the fandom, but the vilifying of c!Dream is shared by MOST of the fandom I would argue. Which is like even more crazy for me because that was c!Wilbur's goal!!!

LIKE I GO INSANE WHEN I THINK OF THIS BECAUSE HIS REACH IS JUST TOO POWERFUL. HE'S NOT EVEN ENTIRELY REAL, JUST A MANIPULATIVE PERSONA OF SOME BRITISH GUY.

And I mean... maybe people who have watched Wilbur's video on the SMP still maintain this idea that Wilbur wasn't always the bad guy, but honestly... I wouldn't be surprised if their introduction was still an animatic. Like bias is hard to check and I'm not going to lie I could have sworn I watched both Wilbur's AND Tommy's video on the SMP in the beginning and yet I STILL was a ride or die for tragic yet on some level still honorable Wilbur and a resilient Tommy.

Like... upon watching Wilbur's first video... possibly again I was surprised because I thought I did watch it like right before I even started watching the streams and yet I was still so invested in c!Wilbur as this tortured anti-hero.

It took 6 months of... not being in an echo chamber, full of multiple different people of different ages, different stream POVS, and people who joined the fandom at different points in time.

IDK IF THIS WAS EVEN ENTIRELY RELEVANT IT JUST FELT TANGENTIALLY RELEVANT AND THIS WAS SOMETHING I'VE BEEN THINKING ABOUT FOR A HOT MINUTE AFTER LIKE WATCHING WILBUR'S FIRST VIDEO AGAIN.

TLDR;

SBI CENTRIC ANIMATICS HAD A LASTING AFFECT ON THIS FANDOM AS IT'S HARD TO GO BACK AND ACTUALLY CHECK THE NARRATIVE FOR SOLID FACTS FOR YOUR OWN INTERPRETATION BASED ON THE FACT THAT THIS NARRATIVE SPANS OVER HUNDREDS OF HOURS WORTH OF TWITCH STREAMS.

#asks #anon #dream smp #dsmp #dsmp analysis #dream smp analysis #dsmp meta #dream smp meta #my analysis #long post

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lucemferto · 4 years ago

Text

WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT PH1LZA (or Why Philza is a Victim of Narrative Circumstance)

Heyo! Per request I am posting the script to my video of the same name here on tumblr. I must warn you that just reading the script will probably not give you the full experience, so I would encourage you to watch the video (linked above).

There might also still be a lot of grammatical errors in the text, because I don’t proofread.

Intro

LAST TIME ON LUCEM FERTO

Okay, so! I don’t want this to turn into a reaction channel OR a Dream SMP channel for that matter! [echo]

Well, I lied.

[Intro to “Luc is pretentious about the funny blockmen. Episode 2”]

I swear, I’m working on other stuff. It’s just that my dumb lizard brain has only capacity for one interest at a time!

So, something you might not know about me, is that I am on tumblr – who am I kidding, most of you will know me from tumblr. Before starting this whole YouTube thing, I thought that website died years ago – but as per usual reality proves me wrong. I’m also on Twitter and Reddit, but I get the most engagement on tumblr – by far! – and I need those sweet, sweet numbers for the serotonin!

Anyways, one of my favourite past-times on tumblr is to razz Philza Hardcore Minecraft – that’s his full name – for being a frankly awful father [clicking away] – wait, wait, no! Philza fans, this isn’t a hit piece on him, I promise! Please come back!

This is video is meant to be a companion piece to my previous video about Technoblade and the Doomsday event – you can tell by the shared nomenclature – so you should probably watch that one before you proceed. Unless you don’t want to, which is also perfectly understandable.

DISCLAIMER: This video is mostly about the character Philza plays on the Dream SMP. Whenever I talk about the content creator Philza, I will say so properly. Also, Spoiler Warning for Dream SMP Season 2.

… What is that? You’re wondering what the Dream SMP is? Well, if you had just watched the other video like I told you to do, you would know, because I explained it pretty well there. But in case you don’t know, here’s the cliff notes.

Dream SMP is the hottest New Media Series on Twitch right now! It has it all: gaslighting, child soldiers, Machiavellian political intrigue, Hamilton roleplay, desecration of the dead, shounen protagonists, SO! MUCH! AMNESIA! Filicide, furries, a red egg that’s definitely homophobic and teenagers inventing nuclear warfare. And it’s all done in Minecraft – yes, the funny block game where the only way to emote is to crouch.

And you say the perfect brief doesn’t exist!

Now, you might be wondering, why do I want to talk about this? Well, it’s because Content Creator Philza is one of least controversial internet personalities that I can think of. That man exudes pure comfort. So, it’s just very, very amusing to me that his character became one of the most controversial figures on the SMP, only outshone by Tommy and Technoblade.

And it’s not just amusing, it’s also extremely interesting! I want to dig deep to uncover and discuss the dynamics behind why that is. How did it come to this point? How did a man who appears genuinely so pleasant create a character that inspires so much discourse!

Now, if you watched that Technoblade video – like I told you to twice now! – you might know, that I am the resident character analyses hater of fandom! And that impression is false and slanderous! Don’t tell other people that I hate character analyses! I love them!

It’s just that, in the Dream SMP in particular, there is an abundance of character analyses! Every streamer has at least two very good essays written about them, exploring every possible angle to view their characters and backgrounds and everything. All I’m saying is: I don’t have anything to add on that front.

So, instead I want to pursue a different approach – something, that I feel is a bit underrepresented in the fandom! And I’m not just talking narrative analysis – that’s right, this episode we’re going even more pretentious! – I’m talking Transtextual Analysis!

Now, what is Transtextuality? Well, unfortunately it has very little to do with actual Trans people – #transrights, just in case that wasn’t obvious – but instead describes a mode of analysis with which to put – to quote French literary theorist Gérard Genette – “the text in a relationship, whether obvious or concealed, with other texts”.

Basically, you know how the L’Manburg War of Independence heavily quotes and borrows from the hit musical Hamilton? That’s transtextuality! A lot of the analyses surrounding how Tommy mirrors the Greek hero Theseus, who was invoked by Technoblade multiple times in the series, are already doing transtextual analysis! So, it’s really not something that’s new to the Dream SMP fandom.

But how does this apply to Philza and how he is looked at and judged by his parental skills? Well, there are multiple forms of transtextuality, two of which we will discuss today.

But before we continue, I gotta do that annoying YouTuber thing. I know these videos don’t look like much, but I spend a really long time making them. I work fulltime and I try my best to keep up, but sometimes I can’t. So please, like, subscribe, comment to give me some algorithm juice – I really need it – and most importantly share it! Share it with your friends, share it with your family – I’m sure Grandma is very interested in what I have to say about Philza Minecraft.

And I’m trying to be better! If I sound at all different for this video, it’s because I finally bought a new pop filter, so I can hit my plosives without it sounding like there’s a thunderstorm in my room. I hope it makes a difference; it was a very cheap pop filter, so maybe it doesn’t. Maybe it sounds worse – that would be bad!

What was I talking about? Oh yeah, CHILD NEGLEGT!

Intertextuality: Why is Dadza?

You know what’s really interesting about the Dream SMP – aside from, you know, most things about it? Very few of the characters have concrete, fleshed-out backstories – and that’s pretty weird! In no other medium or genre could you get away with something like that – at least for long-form storytelling!

So, how does Dream SMP get away with this? Well, it’s because every character on the Dream SMP is basically a self-insert – and I don’t mean that in the “This character is based on me”-kinda way, but in the “This character, for all intents and purposes, is me!”-way. This, like many things that are fascinating about the Dream SMP, is owed to the fact that this series didn’t start off as a continuous drama – it started off as a Let’s Play.

And while we can talk about how someone’s on-camera/on-mic persona is in some ways a character, it’s still miles off of being an actual, fully-realized, separate character in a storyline.

This is where Intertextuality comes in.

Intertextuality is a subset of Transtextuality. It describes how the hypertext, which is the text, you’re currently engaged with, uses another text, the hypotext, to supplement itself. The interconnection the hypertext establishes with the hypotext, through stuff like allusion for example, uh-hum [Hamilton], can colour how an audience interprets the hypertext. Basically, Hamilton and Theseus are the hypotexts; the Dream SMP is the hypertext.

So, what does this have to do with backstory? Simple: The backstories of the characters in the Dream SMP consist basically of nothing but intertextual references. Through intertextuality their content effectively substitutes their character’s backstory.

You can see it everywhere. Wilbur’s and Schlatt’s relationship and rivalry is hugely enriched, if you are aware of their shared history like SMPLive, for example – I think anyway. I haven’t watched SMPLive, because … there’s only so many hours in the day and I cannot keep up with the Dream SMP and catch up on SMPLive and live a healthy life – which I already don’t do, so…

BadBoyHalo’s and Skeppy’s relationship, which has become the crux of the Crimson-Storyline of Seasons 2 and 3, is hugely supplemented if you know that they’re also very close as streamers and in real life.

Another great example of intertextuality is basically Technoblade’s entire deal. If you just look at him completely within the text of the Dream SMP and try to transplant his entrance to any other medium: It would be extremely weird! Like, he’s just this guy that comes in in the middle of a very climatic arc, no build-up, no explanation what his deal is, and he’s treated like he has always been there. In any other medium that just wouldn’t work – at least not without a flashback or some sort of exposition!

But because of stuff like Minecraft Mondays, the Potato Wars, his Duel against Dream and SMPEarth, we understand that he is a Big Deal!

Anyways, to bring all of this back to Philza Minecraft: What kind of hypotext informs how the audience sees his character? Well, this is where I will have to talk about SBI.

SBI is an acronym that stand for State Bank of India, the 43rd largest bank in the world and…

It also stands for Sleepy Bois Incorporated. Sleepy Bois Incorporated is a loose assembly of content creators, consisting of Philza, Wilbur Soot, TommyInnit and Technoblade. It is most well-known for its very endearing family dynamic – a dynamic that is frequently acknowledged and played up by the creators involved. Tommy is the youngest brother, Wilbur and Techno are the two older brothers and Philza is of course the dad. And when I say, it’s played up, I really mean it! Wilbur seems to be especially enamoured with the idea and leaves no opportunity untaken to bring it up – which we will come back to.

And I’m not saying that they’re faking this and this is somehow an act. While I know none of these people personally, it appears to me, that this is genuinely how they interact – if a little exaggerated for the streaming experience. Even when they’re not consciously playing into the family dynamic, their interactions still very much lend themselves to that interpretation by the viewers.

Philza especially just radiates Dad-Friend energy – so much so that it has become a huge part of his brand identity – yay, I can bring that back (check out my Christmas video if you want to hear me ramble about that). The nickname Dadza stuck even before SBI was a thing.

So, even if we completely disregard SBI – which we shouldn’t for reasons I’ll get back to – Philza has cultivated an image of strong paternal guidance. He is, in my opinion completely deservedly, regarded very positively. He is highly respected and in turn seen as a voice of reason.

All of this would eventually inform the hypotext of the character Philza within Dream SMP.

Interlude: Before Dadza & November 16th

Okay, so now we have established that a) Dream SMP heavily hinges on intertextual readings by the audience to supplement character backstory and b) that Philza’s entire deal is that he’s the dad-friend – more specifically that he’s the dad of SBI (not the bank). I think you know where this is going.

So, yeah, ever since it was on the table that Philza could join the Dream SMP, it was immediately assumed that he would take on the paternal guardian role all these traumatized people on that server so desperately needed – and with good reason! Like I said before, the audience at this point was trained to take intertextual interpretations as basically canon or at the very least canon-adjacent.

I want to emphasize that this is most likely not done deliberately. I’m sure content creators Wilbur and Philza didn’t sit there and said: “Yes! We will rely entirely on the audience’s inclination to interpret our characters intertextually to define character Philza!”. Like, obviously that did not happen.

But it’s also important to remember that unlike with traditional media and the fanbases cultivated there, the separation between the Dream SMP and its audience is almost non-existent – and purposely so. The story events are streamed live, Chats are acknowledged in canon and even outside of livestreams creators are extremely involved with the fandom. So, the weight of fan-expectations is equally amplified and will more likely be incorporated into the writing process. Case in point:

[Wilbur “I miss Philza”/Philza about Wilbur]

During Wilbur’s villain arc, even before his official involvement, Philza became a prevalent point of discussion. The hope that he would be the one to snap Wilbur out of his downward spiral was not only wish-fulfilment on behalf of the fans; it also very much played off of the intertextual reading of the SBI-dynamic in relation to the Dream SMP.

Of course, this still doesn’t make Philza and Wilbur canonically blood-related – but it definitely used the “paternal”-dynamic of SBI to build-up tension and drama.

And that ultimately brings us to November 16th. The Grand Finale of Season 1 and Philza’s first canonical appearance on the SMP.

Now, for this I want to pull back from the transtextual analysis and talk about simply narrative analysis: What is Philza’s narrative purpose on November 16th?

Philza serves as the last threshold on Wilbur’s Villain’s Journey – to appropriate Vogler’s version of the monomyth for a minute here – he is what Vogler calls the “Threshold Guardian”. He is the last enemy the Hero faces before completing his quest – in this particular case Wilbur’s quest is to blow up L’Manberg. Multiple people have at this point tried to dissuade him from this course of action: Tommy, Quackity, Niki and others. So how come this Philza moment is not redundant in terms of dynamics compared to these prior scenes?

Well, it’s through our intertextual understanding of Wilbur’s and Phil’s relationship. Because Philza does not just occupy the role of the Threshold Guardian – he is also implicitly the Mentor. Before Phil there was no character in the storyline that held a higher position of moral authority than Wilbur – Dream and Schlatt, while at points more powerful in terms of actual authority, were never positioned by the narrative as Wilbur’s superiors in the same way as Wilbur was to Tommy, Tubbo or even Niki.

Before November 16th all challenges Wilbur faced were from people narratively subordinated to him. But that trend is broken with Phil. That is why he is the Threshold Guardian, why this confrontation is at the climax of Wilbur’s arc. Because Phil is the last thing tethering Wilbur to whatever morality he held before his villain arc; Phil is the last, moral obstacle Wilbur has to discard before gaining his reward.

And, just a quick sidenote, because I’ve seen it around the fandom a bunch: When I’m referring to Wilbur denouncing his morality, I’m using that in terms of narrative analysis. I’m mentioning it, because Wilbur’s character can very easily be read as mentally ill or neurodivergent and some people have – rightly! – pointed out that the excessive vilifying when talking about his character is … problematic, to say the least.

So, I just want to make clear, this isn’t a character analysis, I’m being purposely broad when talking about Wilbur and Phil.

In the end, Wilbur takes that final step and gets his “reward”: As his final request his mentor takes his life and vanquishes the evil – the dragon of Wilbur’s story slays the dragon of L’Manburg. It’s very Shakespearean in its tragedy – but beyond the larger theatrics it’s not really used to further characterize Phil – at least in the context of Season 1. There’s not a lot of focus on his characters internal conflict during November 16th.

Phil, like Techno, is very utilitarian in how content creator Wilbur writes him: He serves as a moment of hype; an obstacle Wilbur has to face; a participant in the tragic climax of Wilbur’s character and ultimately takes on his implicit and expected role of mentor and guiding figure to the rest of L’Manburg.

I think not a lot of people talk about how Philza does not join Technoblade during November 16th. He takes the side of L’Manburg – he fights against the withers and he joins Tommy, Tubbo and the others at the L’Mantree, thus framing him as loyal to the L’Manburg administration – even though Season 2 would make his loyalty to Techno central to his character. But more on that later.

What’s also important about November 16th is that this is the day when the general intertextual interpretation became canonized text.

[You’re my son!]

Wilbur is made Phil’s canonical, biological son. The intertextual interpretation of SBI as it pertains to these two characters on the SMP was completely reinforced by the narrative. Or to put it in Fandom terms: The headcanon became actual canon. At least when it came to Wilbur … but what about Philza’s “other” children?

Well, that leads to our second form of transtextual analysis:

Paratextuality: Is Dadza?

These titles are just getting better and better.

The Paratext is defined as all those things in a published work that accompany the text. It comes in two forms: One of them is the Peritext, which are non-diegetic elements directly surrounding the text – like chapter titles, author’s notes, and stuff like that. Translated to the medium of the Dream SMP, it would be stuff like this:

[Examples]

And, trust me, I could make a whole separate video about how people on the SMP use their peritext as a tool for storytelling – I’m looking at you, Ranboo – but that’s not what we will talk about in the context of Dadza.

Instead, we will focus on the second form of Paratext, the Epitext, which consists of all authorial and editorial discussions taking place outside of the text. That’s stuff like interviews, private letters or J. K. Rowling’s Twitter Account – you know, before she decided to become a full-time asshole.

[Wilbur: Transrights]

After Season 1 ended, Wilbur indulged pretty heavily in providing epitext for the Dream SMP, something he had not done prior to November 16th. His paratextual additions ranged from the playful, like assigning DnD alignments to various SMP members, to the extremely impactful, like the whole three lives system!

You probably think, you know where this is going. Wilbur provided some epitext about how Tommy and Techno either are or are not biologically related to him … and I have to be honest I thought that too. But then I began looking into the impenetrable web that is the SBI-canon on the Dream SMP and found this!

[Ghostbur explains family]

So, it wasn’t paratext, it was just straight text. Said in character, in canon, without any implication that we the viewers should question this. The text of the SBI family dynamic was explicitly linked to Dream SMP-exclusive lore, namely Fundy being Wilbur’s and Sally the Salmon’s son. This is as clear as Philza’s anguished declaration on November 16th in establishing the intertext as text. And because Wilbur also had a very heavy hand in the discussion of paratext around that time, it gave his character’s words even more “canonical” weight. Metatextually speaking, this very much read like the author giving exposition through his character – exposition that we should understand as reliable.

And, by the way, before I continue, I need to give a huge, huge shoutout to kateis-cakeis on tumblr, I hope I pronounced that right, who was just so quick in providing me with these crucial clips. Without him I would have looked for days because these people don’t archive their shit! And the Dream SMP Wiki was NO help, by the way! I love what you guys do, but stuff like this belongs in the Trivia section on characters’ pages!

Anyways, basically during the entirety of early Season 2 the SBI family dynamic was basically canon to the SMP. Sometimes it was only alluded implicitly, again letting the intertext fill out the rest.

[Philza clips]

But just as often it was just explicitly talked about – both in the text and in the paratext.

[Fundy clip/Wilbur “Twins” clip/Tommy clip]

So, I know what you’re thinking: “Why is this part called paratext, if the entire family tree is just textual”. Well, that last clip might give you a hint, as to what I will talk about. Notice how Tommy, one of the people most directly impacted by the canonization of SBI lore, is both unaware of and seems generally unenthused about it, to put it nicely? Well, that would soon turn out to be a much bigger deal than anyone could have imagined as he wasn’t the only one.

[Technoblade decanonizes SBI]

Yeah …

This happened on 20th of December. Regular viewers of this channel will remember that I put out a 90-second joke video, where I complain about this very development. And while I was mostly kidding around, the core idea is still true. The paratext provided by Technoblade and established text were in direct contradiction with one another – and that brought a lot of confusion into the fandom. Confusion, that would soon be followed by frustration.

Because Techno only decanonized himself as part of the SBI family dynamic – but what about Tommy and Tubbo, the latter of which was incorporated into the dynamic exclusively within the lore of the Dream SMP. Was this still canon or wasn’t it?

What followed was a muddled mess of contradictions, intertextual implications, text and paratext in conflict with each another. It was for the most part inscrutable to figure out how Tommy and Philza related to one another. I’ll spare you every comment made about this – mostly because I want to spare myself from looking for all of them.

In the end, the current status is that their familial relationship is … unclear. Philza said, again in paratext, that it’s ultimately up to the writers to decide, whether or not Tommy is his son … which, I personally think he and Tommy should be the ones to establish that, but I’ll come back to that later.

But why is all of this important anyway? Why would this ambiguity create such an uproar, such controversy – especially when it comes to Tommy’s character? What makes Tommy’s and Philza’s relationship such a target for discussion in the fandom?

Well … this is where we will have to talk about the storyline of Season 2.

Interlude II: Tommy’s Exile and Dadza in Season 2

Okay, Season 2. This is where the spoilers are, so I will just sneakily drop this again. It took me five seconds to google this gif and I will milk it for every penny it’s worth!

At the beginning of Season 2, Philza’s narrative role has not changed much from where Season 1 ended. He is in L’Manburg dispensing earthly wisdom, being a paternal figure to Fundy, Ghostbur and Tubbo, helping with the nation’s rebuilding efforts; just generally occupying the role of the mentor.

[clips]

And then came … the Exile. The Exile Arc took place between December 3rd and December 15th during Season 2 of the Dream SMP. It revolves around TommyInnit getting exiled from L’Manburg and slowly getting psychologically tortured and broken down by Dream. It’s a really great arc, at least in my opinion, that explores and deepens a lot of Tommy’s character relationships, whether that be Tommy and Dream, Tommy and Tubbo or Tommy and Ranboo. One relationship, however, is noticeably missing.

So, yeah, Philza spends basically the entirety of the exile doing pretty much nothing of consequence. And that’s not a problem specific to him – One big criticism I would levy against the Exile Arc is that a lot of characters are left spinning their wheels. Which is why we get zany stuff like El Rapids, Drywaters, Eret’s Knights of the Roundtable, Boomerville – anyone remember Boomerville, that was a thing for 5 seconds, wasn’t it? – basically a lot of storylines are started and then unceremoniously dropped. Now, I will talk more about this, when I make a video about Season 2 of the Dream SMP … in ten years, look forward to it.

In the case of Philza, this inaction was especially damning, because at this point it was still a considered canon that he was Tommy’s dad. So, the fans were left with a situation, where just a few weeks prior Philza was occupying a paternal role for Fundy and Ghostbur … but now, that his youngest son was in a very concerning predicament – to put it lightly – he was nowhere to be found.

So why is that?

Well, the most obvious answer is that Dream and Tommy didn’t write him into the storyline. We’ve seen that Tommy wasn’t particularly interested in exploring a familial relationship to Philza, at least at the time. And it would just not fit in with what Dream and Tommy tried to do with the Exile Arc: they wanted to tell the story of Tommy being isolated, completely under Dream’s mercy, slowly worn down and manipulated. If Philza had been constant presence for Tommy during that time, it would have definitely shifted the narrative focus. That doesn’t mean that they couldn’t have done that, it’s just a matter of fact that they didn’t.

This also reveals another truth about content creator Philza’s character work, that I think is extremely crucial: He takes what the writers give him. Outside of a few choice moments, he doesn’t seem particularly interested in expanding or even solidifying his character on the SMP.

What I’m saying is that he is very go-with-the-flow: Wilbur wants to enact a Shakespearean tragedy? Philza’s up for it. Fundy wants him as a parental figure and mentor? Philza’s here for him. Tommy, conversely, doesn’t want him as a paternal presence, even though it would make sense for Philza’s character, as it was established so far, to be there? Philza will oblige.

The reason I’m mentioning this is because, while Tommy and Dream were unwilling to utilise Philza in their storyline, someone else was more than happy to. Which leads us back, like it always does, to everyone’s favourite Porky Pig-kinnie in a crown: Technoblade.

Technoblade and Philza, from everything I’ve seen of them, seem to be very good friends – and they share a lot of history even outside SBI. So, it’s commendable that they would collaborate on a storyline together.

A consequence of that, however, is that Philza’s narrative purpose shifts completely with very little transition. His entire character changes from being the Mentor-figure of L’Manberg to being pretty much exclusively defined as Technoblade’s ally; his man on the inside. It is a very sharp turn from the end of Season 1. Their relationship is once again informed via intertext – this time the Antarctic Empire on SMPEarth serves as the hypotext – but there isn’t a huge effort made to smoothly integrate that aspect of Philza’s character into the larger narrative framing around him.

How much the narrative utilisation of Philza has shifted can be very easily observed through the Butcher Army event on December 16th, a story event that I like less and less the more I think about. Here Philza is used to show just how corrupt and violent Tubbo’s administration has becomes. He is no longer the respected mentor, he is now the stand-in for the oppressed populace, similar to Niki’s role in Season 1. On a narrative level, he is here to prove a point.

If you’ve seen my Technoblade video, you know how I feel about … just that entire storyline, so I will not reiterate too much on it. I just want to make clear that I’m not principally against this development – if they wanted to truly explore Tubbo going down a dark path and getting corrupted by power, so much so that he would even treat the person who effectively raised him like a prisoner, I would be extremely here for it, I cannot stress that enough.

The problem I have is that it’s just so sloppily done. It is not coherent with how these characters behaved and, more importantly, how they were narratively framed prior to the Butcher Army event. Fundy gets one token line about Phil being his Grandfather – a far cry from the very emotionally complex relationship they had established at the beginning of Season 2 – and Phil then callously disowns him.

The major problem simply is that we don’t see how Philza changes from Mentor-figure to embittered, oppressed citizen. And there was enough time to build to that. During the entirety of Tommy’s exile Tubbo was pretty much spinning his wheels and Quackity and Fundy were opening up plot cul-de-sacs that didn’t end up going anywhere. This is time they could have spent on developing their relationship to Philza and the dark path they were going down – but again, Season 2 video.

There is not much to say on Philza’s narrative purpose and framing beyond the Butcher Army event. He remains pretty much exclusively Techno’s consigliere with his role as Mentor to L’Manburg a distant memory. He has some cute character moments with Ranboo, because content creator Philza is just big dad-energy whether he wants to or not, and whenever he and Ghostbur share a scene suddenly the narrative remembers that there are people other than Technoblade that should exist in Philza’s inner world. But aside from that, Philza’s storyline in Season 2 remains … pretty definitive is the nicest way I can put it.

Most importantly his relationship with Tommy continues to be completely unexplored – whether by chance or choice – and that combined with ever vaguer paratext leaves “Dadza” in a very peculiar situation.

Conclusion: Is Dadza a Good Dadza?

So, the question to end all questions. The big, obnoxious text, that I will probably have put in the thumbnail – I haven’t made it yet, but I know myself. The honest answer is: I couldn’t tell you.

I have, in the past, been expounding the virtues of narrative analysis. That is because I feel that Narrative Analysis and Textual Analysis, like in this video, can provide certain tools that Character Analysis lacks. Often times I see people trying to get at a writing problem or query and getting frustrated because they’re not using the toolset, they need to figure out what they want to figure out.

But I’d be a hypocrite if I pretended like everything could be solved through the modes of analysis I prefer. And I think the Dadza-issue is exactly such a case.

I set out to explore why the Philza-Tommy-“Dadza”-relationship has become so controversial. It’s a combination of expectations build up through intertextual readings, that were partly canonized – something that is very common for the Dream SMP – conflicting pieces of paratext, which only serve to muddle the issue further and a text that is not only completely uninterested in actually exploring Tommy’s and Philza’s relationship – as it stands right now they might as well be strangers, narratively speaking – but also completely changes Philza’s narrative purpose as it relates to characters like Fundy or Tubbo about half-way through with little to no transition.

That is why I say, that Philza’s character is a victim of narrative circumstance. Because unwittingly, through all of these factors and decisions, there is not coherent reading of Philza that frames his parental skills in a particularly kind light.

The question of how we can judge Phil as a paternal figure ultimately falls within the purview of the character analysis – and that’s a very multifaceted issue, highly dependent on which POV you focus on and how you interpret the other characters in that POV’s periphery.

To put my cards on the table, I think that Philza is a very flawed father/father-figure – and I find that absolutely okay. Flaws are the spice of character building. He is not Cinderella’s Evil Stepmother – but he’s also definitely not Mufasa. If we were to read Philza as a paternal figure, then he would have made a lot of mistakes and decisions to the detriment of his “children” – least of all everything that happened on Doomsday.

But I also have sympathies for Philza fans who are tired of the Dad-Debate and would like to have his character judged independent from his relationship to Ghostbur, Fundy, Tubbo and Tommy.

Ultimately, to bring it all to a point, I’d like to end with saying, that I think that Philza, out of all the characters on the SMP, has the potential to be on of the most intriguing, multifaceted ones. There are all of these different patches of story, character moments and narrative and transtextual implications, that, if brought together, could create a beautiful tapestry of the character Philza.

You have his relationship with Techno, which holds the potential for so much emotional conflict and vulnerabilities, you have his time as mentor of L’Manburg, which is just criminally underused; the complex relationship between him and Ghostbur/Wilbur; and – for me, personally – most intriguingly this weird, almost uncomfortably distant non-relationship with Tommy. That last one is intriguing to me, because it contrasts just so much with our intertextual understanding of the characters and streaming personas – and it just holds the potential for so much conflict, so much drama, so much angst. Which I live for!

And, yes, I do believe that most of this is narrative happenstance, that this was largely not intended by Philza or really any of the writers. It’s just what happens when hybrid-roleplay-improv a long-running, livestreamed storyline in Minecraft.

But I want them to realize the potential they have on their hands, because it could – with barely any adjustments – turn Philza from a victim of narrative circumstance to a champion of it!

Outro

Thank you so much for watching this video. Usually, I don’t record outros this standard, but after this beast of a video I felt it necessary. I hope that whether you’re a Philza fan or a Philza critical or just completely uninvolved in the whole thing, there is at least a little entertainment you could get from this.

I want to take this opportunity to say that my next few videos will probably not be Dream SMP related – a sentence which undoubtedly lost me a bunch of subs – simply because I don’t want to burn out on it. I genuinely enjoy watching the SMP and being exhausted by it would be something I wouldn’t want to force on myself.

But who knows what will happen? The Karl Jacobs video was something I did spur of the moment because the idea just came to me – so I can’t guarantee that the next video won’t be a three-minute joke about Purpled or whatever.

Anyway, my concrete plans for future Dream SMP videos are essays on Season 1 and Season 2 as well as one for Tales from the SMP.

Before that I have a longer video in the works, which I’ve already teased a bunch, so I hope it will finally be finished sometime. And I also may be working on something … eboys-related? Maybe. I’m not making any promises!

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olderthannetfic · 4 years ago

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I get that there has been a lot of mostly young people harassing and such, but like... the amount of hate I see young people getting seems kind of hypocritical?? Like older fandom members are great, and yeah these kids probably don't know the half of it, but... I doubt the fandom moms were perfect as fandom kids. No one is. But there is zero empathy to be found, and all these people espousing downright hatred for kids on the internet. I *work* with kids for a living, if anyone were to dislike them it would be someone who is with them 24/7, but... they don't deserve this. Especially since some TERF or SWERF or some other conservative shit fuck got to them first, probably a parent. Idk. It's complicated.

“Fandom mom” is almost always a pejorative applied by somebody else, honestly. I’m middle aged and trying to get pregnant, and I would never use that dumbass term for myself. But yes, no generation of fandom is flawless. In the past, the m/m shippers tended to be more pro-kink simply by virtue of a homophobic world classing m/m with extreme shit, while the people yelling about ~problematique~ fiction tended to be overtly conservative homophobes. But my fellow m/m shippers were idiotic in plenty of other ways.

Having now spent several years hearing from more randos about the depressing shit that has happened to them, I find myself knowing a lot of 20-somethings who got ostracized by their entire friend group and threatened with all the material those “friends” knew because they had been friends. Even if they were shitty little bullies as part of that pack (and quite a few of them were), that’s no way to live! Nobody deserves to live in fear that all their friends will turn on them if they’re honest about themselves or that their tastes make them a future abuser or that it will be impossible to find another group of friends later.

The problems of ostracism by the other side are very real. It came up memorably after a bunch of the thanfiction stuff in the past and after Laura Hale fought with OTW supporters. I remember the conversations around how it’s important to give people space to back off from their more toxic friends without viewing them as Forever Suspect. All you do then is isolate them with that person you don’t think they should be listening to, whether that person is a full on abusive cult leader or just a persuasive jerk. (And the fact that those conversations were happening points more to the fact that being the bigger person isn’t the norm in these situations and never was.)

I’ve seen some of those conversations in recent years with that ��support ex antis” stuff, but it’s pretty small compared to the volume of messages I see that are like “If I back off from my friends, they will hunt me, and nobody else will want me now either”.

I also pretty regularly run into 20-somethings who are much more ship-and-let-ship in the first place asking me where on earth they can go find some “pro ship” friends, and I never know where to send them. The fact is, all that “conservative Protestantism in a gay hat” stuff has its claws into their age group, no matter which labels people put on themselves.

I don’t think there’s zero empathy. I think when directly asked about it, a lot of older people who are actually paying attention to fandom drama will talk about the social forces in play and how it’s not every young person. But when it’s not the direct topic, people make sweeping cranky statements that are the age equivalent of “Ugh, men!” or “Ugh, the straights!”

I agree: objectively, young people don’t deserve all this blanket blame. OTOH, all the people bitching didn’t deserve all the harassment they’ve suffered, and overly general salty statements are a fact of life on social media. I’m not holding my breath for this pattern to improve any time soon.

I say 20-somethings because, in my experience, a lot of this is 20-somethings and not people younger than that. Tumblr discourse and a fair quantity of twitter discourse is a bunch of 25-year-olds fighting with a bunch of 35-year-olds. Or a bunch of 22-year-olds fighting with 27-year-olds. It’s old vs. young, but it’s not even all that old or all that young. I assume the actual kiddos are off fighting with each other on Amino or something.

People can be dumbasses, including about history, at any age. (Try asking your average person lecturing about strikethrough literally anything about anime fanworks fandom history...)

#fandom meta #Anonymous

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yellowmagicalgirl · 4 years ago

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Hey, how do you and other Krexie shippers work around the age gap? I mean, I ship Krexie and have my own headcanons, but I'm curious to see what others have done.

I feel like I answered this before several months ago, but I don’t feel like finding that post so I’ll answer again. The full answer to your question is a short essay (and that’s without including the footnotes) so I’m gonna put it under a cut. This is based upon my own experience in the fandom, and the krexie circles I frequent are the ones on FFN, AO3, and of course, here on tumblr. Abuse and grooming (in the context of real people) will be talked about below the cut.

TL;DR I’ve seen three main ways of dealing with the age gap: ignoring it, aging Krel up, and aging Douxie down.

Ignore It

This one actually encompasses two different methods. The first of the two is to treat one or both of the boys’ ages as nebulous, with the maturity level of “teenager” and nothing more explicit since Douxie is about nine centuries old and Akiridion royals live for centuries Krel’s exact age is unknown. In this case, the age of one or both of the boys won’t be mentioned aside from being hundereds of years old. In addition, at least on Douxie’s end, this is somewhat canon. Fun fact: Douxie never calls himself a college student, and neither does Archie. Likewise, neither of them call Douxie 19. That was Steve, who deserved far better of a character arc than just to be the idiot that he is in Wizards. However, even though he deserved better Steve is not a reliable source of information on Douxie’s age, but Douxie and Archie are. In Wizards, the only information Douxie and Archie give on Douxie’s age is that he’s about nine centuries old.[1]

The other method of ignoring the ages is to treat Douxie as a 19-year-old (ignoring the immortality) and Krel as a 16-year-old, and to mention one or both of their ages. Their ages are ignored due to one or both of the following reasons: for one, in real life a three year gap between teenagers doesn’t automatically mean the older person is a predator. It’s something to be cautious about, and the younger person really needs to have people they can trust since if the relationship does turn toxic they would have less power and thus be in more danger (usually, though it is possible for the younger person to be more dangerous to the older one), but that doesn’t automatically mean something bad will happen. The other reason to ignore the boys’ ages is because honestly? If someone needs non-canon ships to tell them which relationships are healthy and which ones are dangerous, then their parents/guardians and teachers have failed them. Fanfic authors, fanartists, and other people creating/consuming fanworks on the internet are not responsible for educating random people on the internet. In fact, they and their content are not responsible for if a random person is abused, even if the abuser uses fanworks to groom the victim. It’s the fault of the abuser for being abusive.[2]

Out of these two methods, I’m pretty sure I’ve seen more using the former method of ignoring than the age gap than the latter.

Age Krel Up

This, again, has two different methods. The more common method is to have Krel (and the other Arcadia Oaks High students) age naturally, until they’re at an age that the fanwork creator is more comfortable with having krexie at. These types of fanworks take place years after the events of Wizards. The other method is to create an au where Krel (and likely the other Arcadia Oaks High students) were already the age the fanwork creator is more comfortable with when Douxie and Krel first met. I, personally, have created a lot of content for the first method, and I’ve seen other people use this method as well. My fake marriage au utilizes the latter method, and this method would also work for au’s where Douxie and Krel are both adults when they meet but the au does not follow canon.

Age Douxie Down

This one also has a basis in canon, though I haven’t seen any other krexie shipper use this method of dealing with the age gap. I, personally, use this whenever I want to make krexie content that’s compliant with Trollhunters and 3Below but also do not want to deal wit backwards time travel because I hate backwards time travel. However, someone should write an au where Douxie and Krel are human high schoolers whose biggest problem is being gay for the guy attending your rival school.

Now, while Douxie and Archie gave Douxie the vague age of about 900 years old and Steve made the assumption that Douxie was a 19-year-old college student, Trollhunters actually went out of its way to show that Douxie was a high school student.

In season two episode 10, Mary reveals that she was dating a student from Arcadia Oaks Academy, and Eli remarked that that was their rival school. I was in high school when Trollhunters was airing, and let me tell you: high schools do not have rivalries with colleges. Arcadia Oaks Academy would have to be a high school, or maybe a k-12 or 6-12. However, it’s far more likely that Arcadia Oaks Academy is a high school with the same age range of students as Arcadia Oaks High. In season three episode 1, Mary excitedly tells Claire that a student from Arcadia Oaks Academy is at Arcadia Oaks High. This student is Douxie, and unless I’m remembering wrong he also mentions attending the Academy. Unless Mary knew all along that Douxie was a wizard and was trying to give him a cover story for why he was hanging out at Arcadia Oaks High only for this information about Mary to be cut from Wizards due to time constraints, there is absolutely no reason for Mary to lie about Douxie’s age to Claire. The fact that Douxie was considered to be a high schooler by most of the fandom (some people had been on the train of “he’s a centuries old adult” for a long time) is why the krexie fanworks created pre-Wizards are all treating Douxie like a high schooler. (Yes, people shipped krexie (or at least consumed/produced fanworks for the ship) before Wizards came out. I have my fic on AO3/FFN and other people’s comments to prove it, as well as some fanart saved to my blog. Sadly, some of the people are now antis, and one them has now harassed at least one krexie shipper.)

Personally, when I age Douxie down, I age him down to 17. Only 17. Not 17-plus-several-centuries-without-aging. In-universe he may try to call himself 1492 years old, but he’s really just 17. However, as I mentioned before, if I’m aging him down to 17 then I’m also completely ignoring the backwards time travel aspects of Wizards. And, by doing that, I end up really changing the lore of Wizards. If you would like more information for the timeline I use when I age Douxie down, please refer to this ask.

In Conclusion

Thank you for reading this. These footnotes aren’t nearly as on topic and are more of a ramble.

[1] Re: Douxie having a really vague age of nine centuries. If you take enough chemistry and physics (but in my experience especially chemistry) courses, you will have it drilled into your head that 900 years old could really be anywhere from 850 to 949 years old. So, while 919 is definitely possible in the age range given by the age of “about 900″, it’s really a give-or-take number. However, if we truly want to be accurate, then if we choose to have Trollhunters take place in the 2016-2017 school year, choose to have had the moppet been between 16 and 19 years old at the Battle of Killahead Bridge, and we consider that the late 12th century (aka the time period of Wizards... supposedly, considering that it is not historically accurate) to be the latter half of that century, then Douxie would have to be somewhere between 834 and 886 years old. If we want a 16-year-old moppet and for the 900 years to be an accurate case of rounding, then the Battle of Killahead Bridge would have needed to be in 1183 at the earliest, which is accurate for the description of late twelfth century. If Douxie were to really be 919 in 2017, then the Battle of Killahead Bridge would have needed to take place somewhere from 1114 to 1117, aka the early twelfth century.

[2] Re: the argument that fanwork creators are not responsible for if an abuser uses their content to groom a victim. When I was a kid, the big scare was that strangers would lure off innocent children with candy. We were told not to go anywhere with a stranger, even if they had candy (or puppies, kittens, etc.) I don’t know how many kids have been hurt by strangers promising candy, nor do I know if this is something kids are still being warned about, but I do know that there isn’t some campaign against candy companies for daring to sell candy that an abuser would use against kids. This is because, as horrible as children being hurt is, it’s not the fault of the candy companies. It’s the fault of the abuser. And likewise, it’s not the fault of a fanwork creator if someone else uses their content to harm others.

PS: A side note since we’re discussing ages. I’ve been in this fandom for years, specifically on tumblr, AO3, and FFN as well as one of the discords. It wasn’t until the krexie discourse started that I started seeing people start calling Krel 14. I had seen people call him 15-16 in the past, because the fandom wasn’t sure if he and Aja were twins or had a minimum of a 9-month gap (assuming, of course, that Akiridions reproduce like humans do). That being said, before the discourse I never saw anyone treat Krel (or Aja, for that matter) like he had a canonical age. 14, however, seems to be something that stemmed from the wiki. You know, the same fan-run wiki that claims that Nomura’s full name is Zelda Nomura even though nowhere in the shows, books, games, or graphic novels is she ever called by that name. Yeah, the Arcadia Oaks-Pedia is not a reputable source. I’m going to give the wiki editors the benefit of Hanlon’s razor and hope that they were just going “well, since Krel is Aja’s younger brother and we’re assuming she’s 15-16 years old like the rest of the protagonists he must be 14-15 years old” and it was only after that that antis took the idea of Krel being 14 as canon and then ran off with it to be cruel and cause chaos.

#answered ask #anonymous #krexie #tales of arcadia #trollhunters #3below #toawizards #krel tarron #hisirdoux casperan #fandom discourse #child abuse #abuse tw #grooming #if i wake up to people being dicks about this i will be so mad

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lilydalexf · 4 years ago

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Old School X is a project interviewing X-Files fanfic authors who were posting fic during the original run of the show. New interviews are posted every Tuesday.

Interview with Circe Invidiosa

Circe Invidiosa has 11 stories at Gossamer, but there are even more X-Files stories at her website. Some of my favs I’ve recced here before, like Make It Worse and Slap a Goatee On Me and Call Me Evil. She also made a bunch of X-Files collage art, including some cover art for fics (hers and others), which you probably saw if you were reading fic back when authors posted fics on their own websites where art could be shared. Big thanks to Circe Invidiosa for doing this interview.

Does it surprise you that people are still interested in reading your X-Files fanfics and others that were posted during the original run of the show (1993-2002)?

Well, it would surprise me if people did read my fic. As it happens, I don't hear much feedback from my fic these days. Probably because the bulk of it is on Gossamer and my own site rather than AO3. Also, I was never a BNA. I worked a lot behind the scenes – hosting other authors' sites and making fanart and dustjackets. I think that's what I'd be remembered for, if anything.

What do you think of when you think about your X-Files fandom experience?

I miss the collective excitement and discussions we had as groups. When you got in with a group in the XF fandom, you felt like you knew everybody there. Now the fandom feels a little faceless except for the people I still follow from my old groups.

Social media didn't really exist during the show's original run. How were you most involved with the X-Files online (atxc, message board, email mailing list, etc.)?

Most of my experience was on Yahoo Groups. I joined Scullyfic while it was still there and then E-muse when it became an e-mail list, which I'm still a part of. I was part of several Yahoo Groups (can't remember all of them now), where I'd post my fic, RealPlayer slideshows (remember those?!), and collages. I never really took part in discourse because I'm shy and don't think anyone cares about my opinions (still don't!). The e-mail address I used for those groups was purged a couple of years ago, so I've lost all those messages.

What did you take away from your experience with X-Files fic or with the fandom in general?

My take away is that fanfic made me a better writer, thanks to having some great betas, and it made me a better professional writer for it (my real-life work is writing but not fun writing) because I learned to take criticism.

I also used to make a lot of fanart, collages and dustjackets for fic mostly. My big take away from that was that I really got into graphics and I got super proficient at Photoshop, which helped my own artistic endeavours and photography. I didn't realize how much skill I had developed until I've had to help someone with their graphics or photo editing.

What was it that got you hooked on the X-Files as a show?

My mother was watching X-Files before I was and she was raving about it. I don't have a great relationship with my mom, but one thing she was usually right about was TV shows. It's where I got my love of Sci-Fi.

I think the first episode I watched was Ice, which definitely hooked me. As for when the shipping started, I remember we were watching Lazarus, and when Mulder was yelling at Lula (I had to look that up) about hurting the hostage Scully, my mom said, "Oh, he's so in love with her." And I was all, "What?! Pfff." But then I could not stop thinking about it. And then I thought about it way, way too much.

What got you involved with X-Files fanfic?

I was in my late 20s, and it was around the end of S7 and I kept thinking about what if these two dumb idiots actually talked one day. And I kept thinking about dialogue in my head about what they'd actually say. The internet was still in its infancy back then, but I'd seen fan sites here and there. So I decided to search around to see if other people were talking about it and thinking about it like I was. I was such a noob I'd never even heard of fanfic. Imagine my delight when I discovered it. I found a few stories and thought, 'Well, I can do that.' And I wrote up my first story, found a place to post it (wasn't Ephemeral the best?), got some kind feedback, found a really nice person (not sure she wants to be named since she used her real name in the fandom back in the day) who encouraged me a lot and directed me to all the e-mail lists and Yahoo Groups that I needed to be on, and then, Bob's your uncle, I wrote more and more.

What is your relationship like now to X-Files fandom?

Periphery. Most of my experience in any fandom is now on Tumblr because that's where my attention span is. Show me pretty pictures and funny stuff. I am old now and don't want to think hard.

Were you involved with any fandoms after the X-Files? If so, what was it like compared to X-Files?

Veronica Mars was my next fandom experience. A number of my XF friends got me hooked on VM. The VM fandom was a LOT younger compared to the XF fandom. When I joined the XF fandom, I was the kid compared to most of the other fans who were all goddesses and royalty in my eyes. But in the VM fandom, I was in my 30s and the rest of the fandom were all in their early 20s if not younger. It often showed, so I stayed out of discussions and just posted my fic once I started writing it. I took a new handle (invida) when I started writing VM fic. Just in case these kids felt like my writing sucked, I didn't want it getting back to the XF fandom that I’d branched out and failed spectacularly.

By then fandom experiences had moved over to LiveJournal. I never really got involved in the discourse or the fandom fights. I knew what people were saying and where the schisms were, but I was all about the fanfic and the pretty pictures. Most of my LJ friends just discussed the episodes and posted their fic and that was good with me.

What got me writing fic for VM was Anjou's brilliant VM fic Into the Blue. Seriously, if you love VM S1, read her fic. Just so beautiful.

VM was also where started writing a WIP, which was a wild trip. I wrote a much-loved WIP called Damn, Damn the Circumstance which people still ask me about finishing to this day. Someday…*wistful sighs*

Who are some of your favorite fictional characters? Why?

Scully. She was everything! Lapsed Catholic, degrees in science, skeptic, always trying to work within the rules but still not taking crap. Yeah, she was the best.

Veronica Mars was great until she wasn't. I have a lot of issues with her beyond S2. And don't even talk to me about S4. For me, S1 was the best, I enjoyed the movie, the books were okay, but nothing else happened after that. NOTHING.

And the first character I ever loved was Princess Leia. She was also everything to me growing up. I wanted to be her. I still do.

Do you ever still watch The X-Files or think about Mulder and Scully?

Now and then. Not as much as I used to. I sometimes have it on in the background when I'm doing other things. Back before the pandemic, my BFF and I would have get togethers where we would play Scrabble, eat a lot of candy, and binge several XF episodes. I miss doing that. Hopefully, we will get back to that soon.

Do you ever still read X-Files fic? Fic in another fandom?

I am not an active XF fanfic reader right now. I will read any stories my friends put out. Otherwise, I only occasionally read some I come across on Tumblr in my feed, but I am not seeking them out. I will beta for any XF author who asks me as well.

I am reading fic in other fandoms though – Endeavour, Broadchurch, Sherlock…huh, I'm just realizing that's a lot of British stuff. I have been really into British detective series for the last few years.

Do you have any favorite X-Files fanfic stories or authors?

I used to run an XF fic recommendation site called How Will It End usually with at least one other person (I went through at least 4 partners on that project because I'm a control freak). We'd compile our recs and then I'd post them on my site. We'd also feature authors we really liked and interview them. Not unlike these interviews!

I'm terrible at giving feedback/comments. So I solved that problem by making a rec site. That way I could tell authors I loved their fics by recommending them. I didn't have to comment, I'd just say, 'I'd like to rec your fic'. And then they'd get promotion. Win-win. Back in those days, the fandom would absolutely roast you for promoting your own fic, so to get on a rec site was a big deal. Not that I had a popular rec site or anything. But I think authors really enjoyed being asked.

All that to say I've liked a lot of fics. I can pull up the archives of HWIE and show you all the faves I liked. :)

What is your favorite of your own fics, X-Files and/or otherwise?

Back in the day, E-muse would hold Improv Challenges, where other members would give you a prompt that you had to include in your fic. I was always really proud of the stories I created from those challenges (No Earthly Means and Elephant in the Room if you want to read them).

I enjoyed writing Dead to Rights which is an XF/Dead Like Me crossover because I loved the challenge of writing a crossover. It was the first crossover I ever tried writing even though I only recently published it.

Otherwise, I like re-reading In a Graveyard, Importuning Life for Life, and Some By Virtue Fall. Of my more recent fic, I like Slap a Goatee on Me and Call Me Evil because the premise was ridiculous and I think it's funny as all get out.

Probably my favourite of my VM fic was Stay Outta Riverdale. Because: 1. The title is a Simpsons reference who doesn't love a Simpsons reference? And 2. I think I was hilarious throughout it.

Do you think you'll ever write another X-Files story? Or dust off and post an oldie that for whatever reason never made it online?

I'm always open to writing more fic (and, of course, I don't mean my WIPs…don't look at me like that). Lately, my only motivation has been from writing prompts on Tumblr. I haven't had anyone give me a prompt in over a year, so here we are. I have snippets of dialogue in journals and word documents that have never found their way into stories. I'd be happy to dust off any of those and shoehorn them into a new story.

Do you still write fic now? Or other creative work?

The last fanfic I wrote was a mini-fic over a year ago (with a prompt from Lilydale!). I've written a bit of original fiction but I haven't been able to finish it. Otherwise, I do have a number of real life hobbies which are where my creative outlets lie now.

Where do you get ideas for stories?

Lately, challenges and prompts. It used to be from wanting to see more from a scene. I really had a thing for fill-in-the-blanks or scene continuations. And sometimes my motivation is just plain old spite. :)

What's the story behind your pen name?

Circe Invidiosa is the title of a painting by John William Waterhouse. Love the colours and the absolute malice on the face of the subject. It felt like a good pen name – the envious witch. That's me!

I chose it when I posted my first XF fic (which I cringe to read now, ugh so terrible) without knowing there was already a Circe in the fandom. Whoops. I tried to go by the full Circe Invidiosa or Invidiosa as much as possible after realizing that (invidiosa is my url and my username on a lot of sites, etc.). Now I think that I've been around long enough that it doesn't matter as much but I still like it.

As I said, I took the name Invida for the VM fandom which is just a shortening of Invidiosa.

Do your friends and family know about your fic and, if so, what have been their reactions?

My significant other knows and that was quite a reveal (oh how awkward). However, the SO has been very supportive and has read all my stories since the reveal and sometimes betas them. The SO also wants us to collaborate on writing some original fiction but we haven't found a project that works for both of us creatively or timewise.

My BFF knows because I dragged her into the online fandom. We've known each other since we were 14, but our love of XF really solidified our bond in our 20s. She wrote some short but sweet fics under the penname Helen Quilley which I bullied her into posting, and we wrote Of Ladies Most Deject and Wretched together. She is mostly embarrassed that she wrote fanfic now but we still fangirl together.

No one else really knows other than fandom folks I've met in real life. And some friends know I've written 'short stories' but I don't elaborate. I work in a stodgy, uptight industry where anything fun or actually having a life is frowned upon.

Is there a place online (tumblr, twitter, AO3, etc.) where people can find you and/or your stories now?

Over the first lockdown, I got my shit together and got my fic site, invidiosa.com, up and running again. My site houses fic by Rain (now @doctorhelena on Tumblr and AO3), Helen Quilley, ML (who I miss so much), Folieadeux, Shelba, TLynn, Oracle, Piper Sargasso, Diehard, and me. And I made all their dustjackets (except Folie's). The site got hacked a few years back and it was so much work to get running again that I put it off for years and years. I still feel terrible that I did not get the site back up before ML passed away, especially when ML had asked me about it a few months before she passed.

Anyway, all my XF fic is here: circe.invidiosa.com. I have 3 of my newer XF stories on AO3. And my fic-LJ also has some of my stories. Some of the newer stories are on Tumblr but the tagging is so erratic that I'd have to list several tags before you'd find them all. I don't know why I haven't moved everything over to AO3. Probably laziness.

I'm @invidiosa on Tumblr. I'm still on E-muse. I'm still on LJ. I'm always reachable by e-mail (invidiosa at gmail).

Is there anything else you'd like to share with fans of X-Files fic?

Thanks for reading, writing, and commenting. It is always appreciated.

(Posted by Lilydale on January 5, 2021)

#new post #old school x #xfiles fanfic #xf fanfic #xf fanfic author interviews #circe invidiosa

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theshopislocal · 4 years ago

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So I joined tumblr in December after seething about 15.20 for a little while. Before that I’d been an AO3 lurker and occasional writer in several fandoms, and before that I was (proudly!) kicked off of LJ for my disgusting and offensive PG-13 Harry/Draco drabbles that apparently squicked (a term I’ve recently learned no one uses any more :/) the random Christians who were inexplicably trolling LJ.

I knew very little about the spn fandom - specifically their demographics - when I first came here. I’d sort of been enjoying the show (usually? Eh, like 70/30) in my own little bubble - the same with fanfic and fanart.

To be frank, I was startled to discover the sheer number of younger folks and LGBT+ who are fans. Of course, reading all of your discourse and meta and musings, it makes perfect sense that spn and its characters would speak to young members of the LGBT+ community; I’d just been a little too ‘in my own head’ to put that together.

I’m a cisgender woman, and I’m generally fine with being called straight, though it’s not 100% accurate (what ever is, really?). That said, I wasn’t sexually or romantically attracted to anyone until I was in my early twenties, and my interests didn’t really align with those of other girls when I was in school. So, around seventh or eighth grade when most of the other girls started to go a little boy crazy, a few of them (my friends, actually) decided I was a lesbian. Their 12-year-old, early 2000s reasoning was “well, if you don’t like boys, and you keep your hair short, you’re probably a lesbian.” And I sort of just said “yeah, okay.”

So, when I was around 13 or so (and a newly minted “lesbian”), I started to get interested in media with gay themes. I started with shows like Queer As Folk and The L Word, and oddly enough, even though I didn’t relate to the romantic or sexual stuff because I didn’t feel things like that at the time, I did relate to the characters’ struggles. Feeling like no one knows you, like people can’t accept you, want to change you, feeling alone and different and outcast. Maybe it’s because I wasn’t very pretty, maybe because I was one of the only black girls in my grade, maybe because I was an only child and a latchkey kid; whatever the reason, these gay characters spoke to me. I felt like I knew them, and they knew me.

In true millennial style, I blew through pretty much all the gay stuff my mom would let me watch (she actually got suuuuper into The L Word, we watched like seven episodes in a row on Christmas Eve once), and then started scouring the internet for more content. That’s when I came across sites like Ink-Stained Fingers (a Harry Potter slash archive that might still exist? Idk) and Library of Moria (same thing but for LotR). And suddenly - anyone could be gay! And even though I wasn’t actually a lesbian (though at the time I was rather convinced I was), it still felt fantastic that I could actually relate to these characters, some of whom I’d only vaguely liked in reading their original canons.

I very quickly became a fanfic connoisseur - and it even went beyond slash pairings or any pairings at all. I just liked seeing characters in a new light. I liked seeing people and relationship dynamics that were different, taboo, subversive - because it made me feel better about being me.

I went off to college. Screwed around with some boys, some girls, some people who didn’t call themselves either. Became pretty sure I wasn’t a lesbian, but still didn’t really know what I was; this was over ten years ago, and all the various terminology was still pretty new. Eventually, I met a boy who made me smile and turned me on - both of which were entirely new and singular experiences for me - and I married him.

Cut to: my husband and I watching 15.20, and both of us - cisgender and predominately straight - looking at each other like “wtf is this bro-y bullshit?”

So I thought “fuck this, I need to vent,” hopped on tumblr, and - low and behold - here you all are! It took me a minute to wrap my head around it, to get past the initial excitement of just look at all the people the different people the real people the people who are so very unapologetically themselves!

I don’t think any of you could possibly know how happy I was (am) to see you all, how very beautiful it is that you’re all here.

Anyway. To all the LGBT+ shippers reading this, I just want you to know (re: the deancas wedding, but also just... everything): if even my dumb, straight, weird, who-even-am-I ass can see it, it’s real. You’re not crazy, you’re not delusional, your opinions are not invalid. You’re not just “projecting,” and even if you were, there’s no damn law that says only straight people get to project. Please don’t let shitty people (who are literally too stupid to even capitalize on your interest for their own gain) ruin anything for you.

To any straight shippers: if you’re anything like me, you’re not fetishizing or objectifying gay relationships - you’re relating to characters that you adore in the best way you know how. You’re celebrating the qualities in people that make the world diverse and colorful and beautiful.

To any young shippers: it gets better. You’ll get out. You’ll find better answers. You’ll learn better questions. You’ll figure it all out, or (slightly more likely) you’ll figure out that not everything needs to be figured out. People do hear you, and people do care about you and what you have to say. Your voice matters.

To everyone: there’s nothing wrong with you. And I’m so damn sorry that anyone has ever made you believe that there is. Honestly. I’m sorry.

#idk how to tag this #I guess um #destiel #???#deancas wedding #stfu #chad lindberg #extra stfu #samantha ferris #fandom stuff #tmi #sorryyyy #i love you all

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quillquiver · 4 years ago

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Alex’s Big Nerdy Destiel Canon Rant

I love talking about canon: what it is, what gets to be part of canon, etc. so I want to add my two cents to all the discourse! To my mind, yeah, literary theory uses the word ‘canon’ to describe the complete text (including subtext), but like... that definition isn’t necessarily useful in a fannish context, and it’s certainly not useful in the Destiel fandom.

Just hear me out: even deciding what is part of SPN canon text-wise is a mine-field. Are we counting what Jensen and Misha have said at cons? Are we counting tweets? What about the series of SPN tie-in books that exist? If all these things are paratext, and we’re really only looking at what has been said on the show that’s cool, but I suspect that many people have differing opinions on what SPN canon even consists of! And this makes a lot of sense: the show has been around for 15 years, and the fandom is composed of a whole bunch of people whose ideas about canon, even coming into the fandom, are probably pretty different. Plus, we’re an online fandom, so things are de-centralized and it’s wayyyy harder to even agree on or establish a definition of what the actual, canonical source text even consists of.

Setting that aside, language has also always evolved to suit the needs of the community using it. Queer culture, for example, re-appropriates, reclaims and creates new terms all the time (that then may get picked up in mainstream media, where the meaning may change yet again!). Because fandoms can sometimes drastically differ in terms of language usage, I can’t speak to other fandoms besides the ones I’m in. But! By my reckoning, Destiel fandom took the word canon, (which in a perfect world refers to a single, total, indisputable source text, subtext included), and changed its meaning. In the linguistics world, this is called a semantic change! We’ve largely removed ‘subtext’ from one of the things we consider canon, because that doesn’t suit our purposes - due to the really fraught history between SPN creators and DeanCas fans, canon for us has come to mean something different. But more on that later.

At this point, I know a lot of people are gonna argue with me. BUT THAT MAKES IT SOUND LIKE THERE’S AN AGENDA! LANGUAGE IS OBJECTIVE! IT’S A TOOL! To which I say: language has never ever been objective, because people aren’t objective. If you think that language does not exist to serve a purpose, consider the assimilation of Indigenous peoples through the use of English. Or the fact that the Ancient Greeks used to describe colour differently than we do, because that served them better. Language always exists so we can better communicate and understand each other, and policing it has always been a form of subjugation, whether that be through the policing of what language or dialect you are/are not allowed to speak, or how to speak it. One of my profs loved to remind us that grammar is classist - as long as we can understand each other, how something is spelled really shouldn’t matter.

But back to SPN. We as a general fandom have a really unique relationship to our content producers. We always have. It’s the reason we’re the go-to case study when fan studies scholars want to look at the fan/producer relationship in western media fandom. Destiel fandom? An even more fraught relationship, because for a very long time, the producers did not consider Destiel as part of the canon of their own show. If they had, we wouldn’t be having this conversation! But the first time SPNs narrative even deigned entertain the idea of Destiel as existing seriously and explicitly in the narrative, it was during their 200th episode, and it was a “you have your interpretation, we have ours”, which super invalidates the mocking hell they put us through beforehand. The fact that DeanCas fans have been condescended to and queerbaited for so long means that, largely, we’ve decided that DeanCas canon cannot and does not include subtext... even though, yes, the existence of Destiel romantic subtext technically means the ship is, was and has always been canon (i.e. part of the complete episodic source text). After being told you’re delusional, you’re wrong, you’re crazy for so many years, the idea of a canon DeanCas became entwined with the idea of explicit, incontrovertible romantic text in the show, because it’s not only about Dean and Cas... it’s about the recognition that our reading is also correct. That we were right all along.

People will argue with me here, but don’t misunderstand me: I’m not saying that fandom needs approval or validation from the creators - we really, really don’t. Whatever we see in any show is canon just by virtue of it being there, and so is a valid reading, and that is definitely enough. But SPN is nothing if not the exception to almost every rule, because context: 12 years of being told you’re insane by the people in the diver’s seat, and 15 years of having this on-and-off fraught relationship with creators in a way that had previously never happened. SPN fans are close to the writers and producers and actors in a way that very few other shows are, and we have been for a long-ass time. The writer’s room is an authority, for sure, but they’re also like a group of fans we're constantly at odds with, and that means we treat them like we would other fans. We discuss, we ask questions, we argue. And yeah, the mentality of fighting over ownership of the narrative is one that is very early 2000s, but considering that’s when the show started, it’s not a surprise that it never really left us. In other words: because of our closeness to TPTB and our history with them, there’s a desire for recognition and validation (vindication?) that is unique, but nonetheless there and important.

Back to canon. In the literary world, canon is used to describe a complete text (which again, people have a hard time agreeing on what that even consists of), but it’s also used to describe a complete body of literature. For example, you often hear literary scholars talking about “British literary canon”. Here, canon is used as a way of organizing the most important, worthwhile works of a community, and so is also used as a tool of exclusion and subjugation. Canon excludes people, like BIPOC and women writers, to serve the most powerful culture’s interests - it has a very specific purpose. In this same way, I’ve seen people using their own definitions of canon to invalidate the feelings, experiences and definitions of other fans. For example, there have been a couple posts floating around saying that we absolutely and in no uncertain terms need to use the canonical definition of literary theory (one single, subtext-included source text to rule them all) and I have an issue with that because first of all, not everyone knows literary theory, and second of all... why? Canon is and always has been a polysemic term - it has multiple meanings. The OG example of this is religious canon: it eventually stabilized, but like, I’m Greek Orthodox, and my bible does not look the same as that of a Catholic Christian. But to hear both sides talk, they each have the real canon. So canon can mean something different depending on who you’re talking to, even when you’re talking about the same thing. The important thing is that whatever a community decides is canon, that’s it. That’s what canon becomes.

But what if your community doesn’t have one single definition, because canon means something slightly different to everyone? Well, that’s also fine! Because again, language is only there to allow us to understand each other. If we’ve all been talking about canon and largely understanding one another for the past 12 years, that means we actually never had to have these kinds of conversations, because we largely agreed that subtext was not canon, and destiel never really left the subtext. But we just had Castiel confess his love to Dean (still reeling from that), and so the minutiae of what constitutes canon (a kiss, a hand-hold, a love confession) is suddenly pertinent and important - because we’re all on the same side, but we all have slightly different ideas regarding the details, and who the heck knows what we’re gonna get in the finale, if we even get anything. So we’re all talking and yelling at each other, all trying to say my very specific definition is the right one because xyz when in reality... all of us are right.

Believe it or not, this discourse about what the minutiae of canon is, is actually how we come to a more specific definition. That takes years, and will be infinitely more difficult in a community that is so de-centralized and whose members are always changing, but it’ll eventually happen. Maybe. For now, though: your definition? That’s the right one for you.

Do not let anyone shame you for thinking Destiel was already canon, or not thinking it is by the end, or insisting their definition is the best, right and only one. Canon is a polysemic term, and that means your reading is in there. But that also means everyone else’s is, too.

#fan studies #canon #how do i even tag this #canon discourse #?#destiel #linguistics #literary theory #i'm a big nerd #alex attempts to be a lady and a scholar #long post

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starstuffandalotofcoffee · 4 years ago

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Tumblr took that one piece of information about goblins being antisemitic caricatures in some specific historical context and has just been running with it for like 5 years now and indiscriminately applying it to any gross or creepy character. Preschool level literary and artistic analysis mixed with a desperate need to look woke i guess but still 🙄

Yeah...it goes so far beyond that though, and it’s not just limited to fantasy although as someone who consumes mostly fantasy/sci fi and whose Tumblr fandom presence is mainly in those circles that’s a big part of what I see. It’s like people unconsciously picked up on the concept that Jewish people are the ethnic group most targeted for hate crimes in the U.S., but are also are a small group with sufficient internal diversity such that experiences within the group can vary wildly so you often won’t get huge amounts of pushback, and went culturally-Christian buckwild.

Like, just off the top of my head: my mother has been an LOTR fan since the 70s. My sister stayed up to listen to Evermore when it dropped despite having work the next morning. I’m one of four kids and three of us play Dungeons & Dragons regularly, and both of the D&D games I’m in regularly are at least half Jewish. None of these things are in any way inherently antisemitic, in my opinion, and many, many Jewish people like them.

Also I’ve seen like 20 times more discourse about goblins or Ferengi or making a character with green skin than about, say, Shakespeare and specifically The Merchant of Venice, or (with the caveat that I haven’t seen it), The Umbrella Academy. [note: I enjoy a lot of Shakespeare, who was antisemitic in a time when Jews were literally banned from Britain; I refuse to watch the Umbrella Academy because come the fuck on]. It’s almost like the things these people cancel are things they already didn’t like, or things people they don’t like enjoy, and ‘problematic’ ironically becomes a way to justify being a really hateful person while simultaneously making it much harder to address real-world bigotry because of alert fatigue. (see also the recent ‘crypto-terf’ blocklist for an example of that whole fucked up way of being). (also with the major caveat that the complex relationship between Jews and whiteness aside I am personally someone who looks white, a lot of the white people wringing their hands over goblins ignore or even defend biological essentialism regarding a tendency towards violence, or noble savage stereotypes in sci fi and fantasy which is...interesting.)

Some of it is preschool level literary analysis and Woke Points, sure, but I think a lot of people are just too chickenshit to address that antisemitism in history didn’t look like veiled references to goblins. It looked like their own white European ancestors kicking mine out of various countries and launching violent genocidal attacks. Sure, modern-day antisemitism sometimes takes the form of dogwhistles, but also like, the synagogue I went to when I lived in the midwest was vandalized with swastikas on the eve of Rosh Hashana, as was my local train and park when I lived in NYC, and the kol nidre appeal I heard in 2019 referenced that the cost of a security guard, after Tree of Life, is a significant expense. A lot of white Christians have the luxury of looking away from the obvious stuff, and boy, do they luxuriate in it.

My slightly wild theory, and believe me, I’m very aware of the irony in this, also goes back to my general belief that a lot of people really want to seem smart and they think this involves uncovering conspiracies, or focusing on ‘insidious’ secret bigotry. Of course, this means that they outright ignore the stuff in front of their faces; it’s why people will talk about goblins and Ferengi but not actual antisemitism [sidebar: did you know the ‘The American people are not intellectual, to put it mildly’ line came from an interview in which someone claimed the Jewish people perpetuated a ‘counter-holocaust’ against Germany?], similar to how people will happily reblog posts about those White Bitch Karens and feel woke never caring that they were written by white men. When wokeness is a competition, you need to feel like you have extra insight when the uncomfortable fact is bigotry in all its forms is usually much more obvious and blatant and when you’re not the target and when the perpetuator is a creator you like, it takes some actual strength of character and effort not to look away, let alone to address it. It doesn’t take that strength of character and effort to regurgitate tired talking points in yet another flaccid call-out post.

#antisemitism #a rant #Anonymous

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feliciohno · 4 years ago

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IMPORTANT PSA FOLLOWERS PLEASE READ

Hiya everyone, Feli here! So this is a really important PSA that I really need you all to read. I’ve rewritten and reworded this like a million times over the last few months so oof I hope this goes over well but here we go-

So this blog is a side blog that is mostly for Hetalia and where the main fandom I interact with in this blog is Hetalia it’s not the only one, and that’s gonna be an important factor. You see, about a year ago I made this side blog because I got back into Hetalia and wanted to post about it online. However, I knew of the discourse and I knew of the drama and I just didn’t want to be apart of it. I also knew that Hetalia made a lot of people uncomfortable (for valid reasons of course) and I decided I didn’t want that on my main blog. Ultimately it is not my job to be concerned with other people’s internet experience (things like blocking tags and following certain blogs is all up to the individual) but I do like to at least do what I can to make it easier on everyone and myself. So I made this one. However this blog was never really meant to be just Hetalia. Mainly Hetalia, yes, but not just Hetalia. If you remember I have actually posted stuff like South Park on this blog and an anime called Rosario + Vampire (SP needing no introduction but R+V is an anime where there’s no discourse mainly because there’s no fanbase it’s still a,,,, not very good show,,,,,) but of course neither of these ever stuck around long enough in my brain to make much of an impact on this blog so I never addressed it. (South Park might continue to pop up here and there it’s a very old hyperfixation and though I dislike the show these days I still like the characters and just have momentary brain rot ig.) Ultimately this was always meant to be what I call my ‘Discourse Blog’. A blog where I could quietly like content I know has major issues with it and is not well liked while both making sure others on my main blog don’t have to see it unless they want to and keeping any discourse off my main blog all together. (Still not sure if I wanna keep Homestuck stuff on this blog or my main tbh.) The reason I’m bringing this up is because lately I’ve been getting into some stuff that might start being on this blog a bit more often and I wanted to acknowledge it before just randomly doing it that way everyone is prepared and not confused. Please know this blog is still MOSTLY going to be Hetalia so you don’t have to worry about that. I’m still a nasty little Italy kinnie who only thinks about Germany’s hot man tits a good 85% of the day(/hj).

One of the things that might start popping up a bit more is Danganronpa. I’ll be real honest I don’t know why Tumblr’s purity police has such a vendetta against this game there is WAY worse anime out there that I rarely ever see people bitch about. But I started playing it and I like it (wish Kokichi was in the first game but apparently he’s not). I can see some of the issues people might have with it which is understandable so yeah if you wanna keep Danganronpa off your dash just block the tag.

The other thing (and arguably the one that makes me way more nervous and is why I kept putting off talking about it) is Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss. Before you go get your pitch forks and shit let me just talk about this for a second. Yes Vivzie and the shows have very big obvious issues with them but, much like Hetalia, I don’t think it’s actually as bad as people make it out to be. I spent hours in the anti tags and just like Hetalia antis its just people making out things to be a lot worse than they are and throwing around words that really don’t need to be used in this situation. My honest opinion on Vivzie is she’s a woman who never grew out of her 2012 shock humor phase that came with watching too much South Park and she’s too prideful for her own good. She made dumb mistakes and did dumb shit and she did apologize for it all. Of course her apology post kinda sucked and when people bring stuff up she’s not exactly very graceful in her responses. But never the less she’s not the pedo transphobic satan spawn everyone makes her out to be (for more info on this drama and why I think what I think I highly recommend this video, he actively does his research and looks into everything really well and I agree with most of his points). And even if she was I’ve personally never been the kinda person to let people who work on or have made stuff stop me from liking it. I hate JK Rowling but still like Harry Potter, I don’t like Tony Anselmo but I still love Donald Duck. Letting others’ shitty mistakes and bad personalities dictate what I watch and how I live my life has never been the way I lived and I’m really not gonna start today. As for the shows themselves, yeah they got issues. Some of them, again, a bit drug out of proportion by the antis, but still issues none the less. Giving Alastor Voodoo is a big one (it leans into the constant negative connotation that Voodoo is always strapped with despite being a real world religion that actual people follow), Vaggie is very much a bad stereotype and even though Vivzie wasn’t trying to be racist (openly stating that as a Latina she wanted more firey Latina representation) it still has the potential to harm and upset Latino viewers, and then Angel Dust who is kinda a mess and honestly a big way she could have fixed him was just to keep him by his original version instead of changing so much about him (that honestly would need a whole separate post to explain).

So, yes, I acknowledge the issues and stuff in all this content and I’m very open and vocal about the issues just as I am with Hetalia. Liking these things doesn’t change that and I mostly made this post to make sure everyone knows that. But like I said before, your internet experience is up to you. If any of these things make you uncomfortable please do yourself a favor and block the tags. I promise I always keep things perfectly tagged on my blog down to the characters and ships. This isn’t gonna change. I’m pretty confident that no one here will take much issue with this. After all, if you like one of these things you know what it’s like to like things critically. If you have issues with anything on this post or me or anything I say or do come talk to me about it respectfully so no one is left thinking I’m some asshole for liking some dumb cartoon.

TL;DR This blog is gonna stay mostly Hetalia but it’s ultimately a blog for any content I don’t want on my main and if there’s anything you don’t like or that makes you uncomfortable please just block the tags and keep about your day happily

#PSA #vee~#im not giving this post any fandom tags cause i want it to stay out of those tags and be just for my followers to see #but seriously #please regulate your own internet experience #dont focus on stuff you dont like or stuff that makes you uncomfortable #itll only hurt yourself in the end #and if you have an issue with me my ask box and dms are always open (i normally keep dms to mutuals only but if its a serious issue its ok)#sssoooooo ya #have a good day yall ily

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mariaiscrafting · 4 years ago

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I’m the anon about fanfic and fanart. I just want to say that I’m fine with analysis when they talk about how dnf react to each other when they say or do something but don’t really like how they bring that point into their relationship. It’s one thing to me to say they have a flirty friendship but insisting that they have something more in private bothers me. I always thought that fanfiction and fanart are ways to analyze creators or dynamics so I was curious on what you thought of them. Fans always project things onto creators they like so they make things arolving them. I know you’re worried about how this can strain the content creators and other fandoms, but establishing boundaries is important and it was already addressed by the Dream Team themselves so I don’t see why you have to go out of your way to tell dnf shippers to not to analyze them. I’m not here to hate you but wanting to understand how making a call out post to tell dnf shippers to not to psychoanalizing interactions instead of trying to put more of a distance between yourself and the blogs without putting them down. On Twitter, there was a tweet that misinterpreted Dream and George’s first meeting and Dream corrected them but never condemned them for shipping. He also said in many tweets and said in stream that just how they are and said that fans are allowed to do what they want when it comes to them. Also liking a fan tweet where #Dreamfell was dnf related even though the situation didn’t need to be. Twitter is directly involved with the creators themselves so of course it’s hard to ignore. Even then in Twitter you can still mute words. I’m here for a conversation and not out hate. This is Tumblr where it’s mostly Fandom focused and some dnf shippers like to analyze to project whatever onto them so if we don’t want to see it, asking for a tag so you can block it here. Like #dng long post or just block the analysis tag. We’re all responsible to create our own fandom experience so I don’t want to call fans disgusting when they haven’t done anything wrong since Dream had stated He’s fine with it. I don’t want you to feel excluded in the dnf side of Tumblr since you still find the ship nice, but if you don’t want the long analysis posts since it feels morally wrong to you then we can try to agree on separating the casual and the analytical side of dnf. Your feelings towards dnf blog analysises are valid so your fandom experience should be catered to.

I am actually half delirious while answering this, so Imma keep it short and simple.

I do cater my own tumblr experience to what I want. I do block people who post stuff I don't like so I don't see it in the tags. All your advice is nice, but unnecessary.

I think that I should be allowed to criticize circles that I am in in the hopes that they will approve and shift what they consider the norm. Yes, Dream said that he is okay with shipping and has engaged with it and panders to the audience with it. But to take anyone's green light on any issue involving their personal lives, and to run rampantly with it is still fucked.

And look, I don't think I've properly articulated why I call this behavior disgusting. I want to emphasize that I view it as dehumanizing. To reduce a person's behaviors and tendencies to whatever vicarious romantic gratification you can get from them is an appalling act, devoid of empathy. It exemplifies the commodification of CCs for the audience's sole entertainment and that audience's lack of basic respect for them or acknowledgement that they are real life human beings who function beyond whatever romantic framework you fantasize them in. I keep bringing up this example, I know, but it's what incited this whole discourse for me in the first place, but that analysis of Dream's few seconds of silence as him focusing on George's voice because he's just so in love with him? That analysis, and the overwhelming consensus on that post perfectly exemplify just how dehumanizing this crossing of a line can be. It erases the conceptual space for any other, rational and non-romantic explanation for a few seconds of silence that could have easily been attributed to distraction, a moment to collect his thoughts, etc. It also perfectly exemplifies how, through the overanalysis, shippers force CCs into two-dimensional boxes that best fit their wants, devoid of nuance. In this instance, Dream is not a busy content creator who hasn't streamed very often for the past few months and might be readjusting to consistently talking in front of a live audience, or a young adult with ADHD whose brain jumps from point to point in its search for dopamine, or literally any other kind of human being with multiple characteristics and personality traits influencing his behaviors; he is a prop for our self-idulgent ship. I'm reading way too much into this one example, I know, but I just want to also say that this is like a much higher problem than just one post. I don't care about the content of one fucking post, I care about what that post and the methods of analysis employ imply about the rest of dnf shippers. This community is following behaviors that are concerning, and this is just one example of hundreds that exemplify that.

Projection is fine. Projection is employed in RPF fanfictions, character headcanons, different fanart styles - it's all over the mcyt fandom and I don't have a problem with it. My PROBLEM is with people who act like their analyses of Dream and George and literally any other content creator are actually representative of reality. My problem is with people who don't understand that there is a difference between stanning and creating/consuming fan content for a creator's persona, and theorizing about what that creator's actual character as a real life human being is.

Okay, also, I might just be getting more irritable because it's 2 am and I want to be asleep, but I actually do have a problem with you essentially saying that a preferred solution for me is to simply cut myself off from half the community. Basically, I should just plug my ears and shield my eyes if I see problematic content I am morally against? Fuck off, mate. There are many, many things I choose not to start discourse on and simply block or mute because I don't care enough to try and change it. But dnf shipping is something that I actively engage with, is kind of a significant part of my online presence and experience, and also a way I've made a lot of friends in this community. So yeah, I have a vested interest in making sure it doesn't go down the same, fucked paths I've seen other shipping communities go down, and if that means making a discourse post that makes you uncomfortable, I suggest you block me.

I'm not advocating for this fandom to partition up based on what we all think is right and wrong. I want integration of different ideas, useful discourse, and self-growth. And none of that is solved by creating a separate hashtag

#asks #why did i answer this rn im so tired #also not proofreading this v sorry in advance #discourse #just btw im.prolly not answering any more anons on this line of questioning #if you want to send a public ask or just @ me go ahead and we can beefpublicly #but otherwise nah this is taking up too much of my time and mental fortitude #/neg

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nileqt87 · 4 years ago

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Despair For Castiel: A Review

From a series of posts before and after watching:

Before:

As far as I'm concerned, I'm now imagining the Empty having to deal with Gabriel and Balthazar redecorating the Empty into the angel/demon afterlife (probably with a lot of wacky alternate realities and bad porno) with all the free will angels and redemptive demons invited, Cas finding Meg and eventually Jack again for his true happy ending that he can have and Crowley probably trying to install himself as king again. Then when Rowena finally exits as Queen of Hell, she'll join and Crowley will annoyed, but Gabriel will be happy to see her again. LOL.

Megstielers also got robbed hard with all that setup of Cas still pining for Meg for YEARS, the Empty using her image (not Dean!) to taunt him (the Empty clearly saw Meg in Cas' head when it could have taken the form of anyone, including Cas like last time) and a whole dropped plot thread that Cas made a deal with Ruby to break a demon out of the Empty, which only makes sense with the one and only demon he'd actually want to let out of the Empty. That's dangling one 'ship a whole bunch of carrots (like every single Clarence reference for a decade) to rip the rug out from under them.

I suppose I should've seen it coming when the previously on segment for 15x13 was a Pizza Man and the Babysitter retrospective that shoved Cas out of the Pizza Man role beside Babysitter Nurse Meg to shove Dean into Megstiel's sexy times meme. I guess it turned Cas into just Dean's Baby in a Trench Coat (which was an insult about being useless to Dean's cause without powers, which suggests Cas has no worth to him otherwise), since he got infantilized with the removal of the Pizza Man originally being him.

I still haven't watched the episode. The Tumblr crap is that off-putting.

What should've been an epic moment in Cas' story is now tainted by his love of humanity, found family and free will (his real love story is with all of humanity and finding belonging, in spite of always being on the outside looking in on a life he can't have because he's not human) being reduced to horny girls who just want fetish smut with Dean and don't give a fig about canon Cas outside of a toxic, abusive crack!ship. It's always so immature and vapid!

It was immediately clear when I joined the fandom that shockingly few gave a crap about any character but Dean, even refusing to see what he's become in later seasons. Also numerous examples where they admit having not seen the show in a decade or only knowing the show via manipulative .gif sets. Cas and Sam (if they remember him at all) are just props or prizes to be won. They ignore context of familial/platonic relationships. Canon love interests aren't good enough because they're not the big prize of being a main. I also note the deluge of Wincest girls who hate Cas for existing (he's in their way) in the anti-Destiel tag.

I can't say the .gifs are making me want to watch, even though the dialog is vague enough to still fit Cas' actual character for the general audience who isn't glued to social media.

As for Dean's non-reaction, I had similar problems with Jensen's constipated acting back in 15x03 when Cas finally walked away while Dean looked like he couldn't care less, which the writers coincidentally praised Jensen for (holy crap that interview was up his backside) and completely ignored Misha actually giving a good performance in a scene that actually meant something long coming for Cas. I certainly can't say the same about the quality of this scene, which just looks forced on both ends.

I hope I like the episode more than the sounds of it, but my hopes aren't high. This is not how I wanted Cas' final moments on the show to be.

After:

Well, I got up the stomach to watch it tonight. Thankfully, in context, it definitely got blown way out of proportion by what the Hellers turned it into (as usual). Yeah, even when watching while unfortunately not blind to the wackadoodle fandom discourse, it played out better on screen than the .gifs. And frankly, a whole lot less like creepy Care Bear stare nightmare fuel than the few choice screenshots kept showing (yikes). I still wish Sam and Jack had been there, because they're just as much part of what connected Cas to feeling like part of a family (even more so in the later years), but it's not the total monstrosity it was turned into online.

Average viewers who just take canon as is without trying to read into it what they want to be there instead, IMO, will safely interpret it platonically (even if coming after a particularly hellish few years in Dean's personality rot where the whole friendship was beginning to be questionable) more often than not because that's what the canon has said for a dozen years. Again, I repeat that Cas already told the Winchesters he loved them when he thought he was dying.

It's a crime to have Cas' perfect philia (brotherly), storge (parental) and agape-style (sacrificial and unconditional) loves being immaturely twisted into eros in a way that degrades the whole meaning of the character's journey. People telling each other they love one another when it's not sexual should never be mocked into being afraid to do so because of this insidious, willful misinterpretation. If only somebody had told Cas they love him instead of him always being the one with his heart on his sleeve!

This character went from being tortured into a robotic, emotionless, ancient, not-remotely-humanoid being who couldn't relate to the simplest of human needs to being someone deeply in love with humanity and wanting to find belonging amongst it despite knowing it would always end with him watching them all grow old and die after having families and such experiences angels are forbidden from having (another reason why Jack was so important to Cas' story).

The wording is valid for that philia/agape interpretation, given Cas definitely equated Dean (whom Cas watched sacrificing himself for Sam endlessly, including why he had to be raised from perdition in the first place) with a guide role in his learning to understand humanity and proudly-defiant free will before he could love it. It's valid enough to say that Cas wouldn't have broken his programming permanently without being challenged to question everything he'd ever believed and give up his entire angelic belonging. That much of it did begin with Cas just happening to be the angel who succeeded in the Hell rescue.

Obviously, it's also canon that Cas had a long history of not following orders and getting lobotomized by Naomi, but Cas actually understanding humanity and what free will means did happen only after this particular rebellion. I'm very glad at least that was in the speech, but of course, it's being hopelessly ignored.

I stand by my interpretation that what Cas can't have has always been the tragic version of The Little Mermaid where she turns into sea foam in the end. Cas has always looked in on what everyone else takes for granted from the outsider's perspective. There's a part of him that will always be left out, no matter how well he learns to fit in and how much those around him begin to treat him as a real person. Cas never really got to truly belong with humanity, no matter how much he loves and is loved by it. He's also not getting to stay where he wants to be. There's no Pinocchio ending for Cas that turns him into a real Winchester.

Sadly, Dean's constant othering of him and Jack like they're just more monsters to hunt only alienated them more. Jack was someone Cas could relate to as a supernatural being capable of human emotions, which might also have furthered his draw towards Meg. Sam was also someone Cas could relate to as freaks and abominations amongst their own kinds. Sam always had that same struggle, also with his own family. It goes a long way towards explaining why Sam was always so empathetic to Cas and Jack in a way that Dean couldn't be. All three kept conflicting with that black & white humans = good/other = bad mindset that sometimes creeps in with Dean. When Cas was Dean's "best friend" in the early days, he rationalized it by thinking of Cas as being "like" a human ("You used to be human, or at least like one.").

Yet it still remains true that Cas often found himself looking to Dean to teach him about humanity back when he didn't know enough about it to be inconspicuous amongst them. Dean gave him the crash course in both what humanity is willing to do for each other, but also its flaws and failings at the same time.

Perhaps the saddest scenes in the episode were actually Sam watching everyone poof in front of him. Sam has really been forced to watch a lot of death scenes this season all by himself (as with Rowena), but he looked the most broken by Eileen's. Cas is going to be hard on him, because I genuinely think Sam was far closer to him in the end. Sam was the one who actually was trying to reach out to Cas when Dean repeatedly kept him out of the loop. Sam being left out from the final words with Cas or even hearing first-hand about the deal with the Empty just furthers that tragedy. While Dean has been raging at everything in sight, Sam and Cas have both looked broken, sad and tired all season.

#castiel #anti-destiel #dean critical #anti-dean winchester #megstiel #team free will #dean winchester #sam winchester #meg masters #jack kline #eileen leahy #saileen #spn #supernatural #spn 15x18 #spn s15 #s15 #despair

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playingbaseballwithyourson · 4 years ago

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A Comprehensive List of Why REFLEKDOLL is One of the BEST EPISODES

1. I mainly come to this show to watch Ladybug and Chat Noir bitch at each other for a solid 15-20 minutes and, my god, does this episode deliver.

2. “You’d better get going before you lose your clown costume.” I C O N I C.

3. For real, confirmation that Ladybug sees Chat as as much of a goddamn clown as the entire fanbase, it’s great.

4. I know people get on this episode because the ladynoir banter is apparently “”mean-spirited””? But honestly like, banter between friends CAN sound this mean-spirited from an outward perspective while all the friends involved in it are totally fine and in complete understanding that it’s all just joking and in good fun. Ladybug really starts tearing into him (jokingly) and Chat still finishes the sequence by bouncing away yelling “SEE I WAS RIIIIIGHT!” in an upbeat, teasing tone. Like, they’re fine. This is just how they talk to each other as friends and it’s clear neither Ladybug nor Chat Noir take their banter very seriously. (Honestly my banter with my friends can be far more scathing than anything in this episode. XD)

5. Watching Juleka and Luka interact... It’s pure. It’s good. :’3 Just an all around good scene. It’s also nice to follow up on how Juleka’s been dealing with her issues since Reflekta, even though it does turn out she’s made very miniscule progress.

6. Alya’s galaxy brain moment of inviting Adrien to help Marinette with a fashion shoot: Makes a lot of sense and is a great way to capitalize on both the love square’s hobbies to get them to hang out more! It’s the single part of this episode that isn’t a contrivance!

7. Adrienette look cute in the matching outfits. Sorry but they do.

8. Okay, the thing that is truly great about this episode is that everything about it is a massive contrivance to make the kwami swap happens. ML wants it’s fucking kwami swap and it’s going to bend over backwards to make it happen, and it is NOT shy about it and it is NOT sorry. And honestly?? I FUCKING LOVE THAT. Does a kwami swap make logical sense for it to occur without the heroes having planned for it? No. Are we going to do it anyway? YES!!!! BECAUSE A KWAMI SWAP WOULD BE FUCKING FUN!!! That’s what’s great about ML, and this episode is a great showcase of ML’s priorities as a cartoon (which is probably why this episode rubs some of the fandom the wrong way). A kwami swap is illogical, but it’s fun as fuck, so the show is going to do it. That’s the priority above all else. FUN. AND IT PAYS OFF!

Seriously, everything is a contrivance. Why akumatize Juleka again? Reflekta’s power can handicap the kwamis’ abilities to find their humans in the commotion. Why have Marinette and Adrien change for the photo shoot? Get them to take their miraculous off. Why have them keep the kwamis in the car instead of in their pockets? So they can’t find their own kwamis right away. This episode is jumping through flaming hoops to make this happen and it’s fucking gold. Might there have been a much more natural way to have a kwami swap? Yeah, sure, most likely. But literally WHO EVEN CARES cause this episode starts out fun and ends fun, and it works well enough that I don’t give a flumpty. Hell, I appreciate it even MORE for not being shy about its priorities in this episode. Kwami swap fun? Then kwami swap will happen. Fuck everything else.

9. “Are you okay, Marinette?” “YEAH. HE’S TOO HOT. I MEAN--” This is a top tier Marinette flub.

10. I recognize I’m a minority on this, but I fucking love Mayura. She is a goddamn queen. So gosh darn fabulous with the long coat and the fan. I just love it whenever she shows up so I’m glad she’s here. Makes the villains a touch more intimidating in this episode since there’s two, which pairs well with Marinette and Adrien being somewhat off their game due to the kwami swap.

11. Literally any time Tikki and Plagg interact together is great.

12. Adrien telling Marinette to hide in the car... TTToTTT <3 <3 <3 <3 <3

13. No one ever believes me when I say Marinette is pure chaotic energy but she HECKING IS! When she finds Plagg with the cat ring, this girl does not waste a goddamn second. Will swapping powers probably mess them up? Yes, but FUCK IT PARIS IS IN DANGER AND WE NEED HEROES NOW SO GIMME THAT RING. SHE JUST DOES NOT WASTE A GODDAMN SECOND TRANSFORMING. SHE CAN TAKE ANYTHING AND ROLL WITH IT. I LOVE MARINETTE.

14. Also Ladynoire’s design is fucking choice.

15. Okay, go onto youtube right now, look up Mister Bug’s transformation sequence, and look at the way he puts on his mask.... I know right??? :D

16. This is a very personal thing, but I love seeing Adrien powered-up without the cat eyes. This is the only time you ever see it, and trust me while I fucking love the cat eyes, it’s a really eye-catching change to see him with his normal eyes here! Think about it, Ladybug has never seen her partner’s real eyes until this episode. It’s cool! (Marinette with the cat eyes, on the other hand, is neat as well, but I don’t think she wears them as well as Chat Noir.)

17. Adrien smacking himself with the yo yo.

18. I’ve said this before but I find it absolutely adorable how, when swapped, Marinette and Adrien base their new names off of each other, rather than making up new ones from scratch. Mister Bug? It’s Ladybug, but boy. Ladynoire? It’s Chat Noir, but girl. Seriously that’s adorable.

19. ADRIEN USING LUCKY CHARM AND GETTING EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTED IS ONE OF THE SINGLE FUNNIEST MOMENTS IN THE ENTIRE GODDAMN SHOW. I’M SORRY BUT IT IS. IT’S FUCKING HILARIOUS. JUST ADRIEN BY SHEER LUCK SCHOOLING MARINETTE WITH HER OWN POWER, AND THE COMPLETELY OFFENDED LOOK ON HER FACE AFTERWARDS-- IT’S PEAK ML COMEDY.

20. I’m not the first one to make this comparison, credit goes to @buggachat on that, but Marinette in this episode is like the parent trying to teach their kid how to drive but ends up flipping their shit the second their kid touches the gas pedal. And it’s fucking funny. X”D Marinette has a strong sense of responsibility along with an incredibly specific way of how she likes to do things as Ladybug. Her process is you battle the akuma, gather info about your opponent, use lucky charm at the exact right time that only she knows in order to take them down, and then capture the akuma and/or amok. Her routine is pretty broken in this episode, since it’s now Adrien who needs to do all those things, so that combined with Marinette’s acute awareness of Adrien being a Child Who Causes Problems On Purpose has her veerrryyy on edge this whole episode and it’s just fun to watch. Her asking Adrien if they should switch back, correcting him every time he mis-speaks about how to do Ladybug correctly. It’s not a side of Marinette we get to see every day!

21. Additionally, getting to watch her relax for once in a fight since she’s now in the canonical clown costume is wonderful. I love Marinette. I want good things for Marinette. Relaxation and fun are good. She’s got a lot on her shoulders so this episode is nice, especially with the s3 finale in context.

22. Yknow, I can very happily buy that chataclysm doesn’t work on sentimonsters, since it’s already been established that Miraculous magic can protect from chataclysm. (See: Miraculer)

23. I’ve written already about why Mister Bug wasn’t actually bad with the ladybug miraculous, so I’ll only touch on a couple of those points again. But it is weird to me how people cry about Mister Bug being shit at the ladybug miraculous when he’s so clearly not? He just has a lot of stuff to think about that he usually doesn’t have to worry about cause it’s not his job. When to use lucky charm, HOW to use lucky charm, when to use miraculous ladybug, capturing the akuma once it’s released, capturing the amok. He just quite literally never has to put thought into any of that so it’s pretty understandable that he doesn’t have a handle on it just, automatically. Meanwhile, Marinette doesn’t have a ton of extra things to think about with the cat miraculous, AND she’s canonically naturally talented with handling different miraculous, so it’s very believable that she’d be fine? I get people don’t like that cause they have a problem with Marinette (and any WOC) being competent in general, but she’s just a talented girl. We see her take and roll with anything to stop the villain in every episode of the show, so there’s not actually a reason for her to notably struggle with the cat miraculous. But hell, she actually DOES make things worse by chataclysming Reflekdoll, which might have not happened if she paused before just rushing in and using her power (after proudly declaring she is now the Team Clown). But it’s understandable that she didn’t predict the sentimonster to react how it did, and I can see Adrien making the same mistake, so eh.

24. But my point is that in terms of this discourse, I think this episode is fine. It’s about Ladybug and Chat Noir learning that they’re both quite good and very comfortable in their default roles. She’s great at handling her job and he’s great at handling his. That’s a perfectly fine lesson for this episode, and it’s not super necessary for them BOTH to learn that their partner’s job is actually super hard! The episode starts with them teasing each other about their roles, and it ends with that little bit of conflict between them being eased away due to their experiences from the kwami swap. Chat Noir is still a clown, Ladybug still is too concerned with her usual responsibilities to spend a lot of time clowning with him in fights, and that’s okay. They both learn to relax about it. It’s a good lesson for them to learn about each other, and it feels natural for the show to spend some time exploring their dynamic as partner heroes!

25. I actually fucking love how it’s established that the lucky charm works differently for different people. This episode BASICALLY CANONIZES that Marinette’s lucky charm is so insane because SHE HERSELF, IS SO INSANE. Adrien thinks much simpler (which I’ve written about how that’s not a bad thing in previous posts), so his lucky charm is just: You need a mirror? Okay, here’s a mirror. And it’s actually very fun and interesting to me that his ability to use his lucky charm was handicapped specifically becuase he’s only ever watched Marinette use it. Marinette’s lucky charms always yield wildly complicated plans, and that’s the exact thing she’s shouting at him the whole episode, so he expects it to be complicated and thus can’t figure out how to use the mirror. It’s only when they sit down and realize that they’ll have to think on Adrien’s level instead of Marinette’s that they figure out what to do with it! Marinette’s spent the whole episode basically backseat driving for him (understandably), so the fact that the resolution is her meeting Adrien at his own spot and working on his level instead of hers- It’s a good way to wrap the episode up!

26. Duuzu.

27. dID HE JUST DAB?!?!

28. Oh my god he did. And people actually hate this episode, smh.

29. Marinette flirting with Chat Noir will always give me life, and we get so much of it in this episode! Her calling him Bugaboy is this perfect combo of flirtatious and teasing that’s just very on-brand ladynoir. It’s perfect in this episode for literally so many reasons that I don’t even have time to list them cause this essay is already really long.

30. Adrien and Marinette interacting with the others’ kwami? Wholesome. Marinette and Adrien reuniting with their kwamis? Very wholesome. They’re both so attached to their kwamis in different ways, and they’re also together with their kwamis practically every waking moment of their lives. I can imagine being apart from them even for a little must’ve been a touch anxiety inducing, so it’s nice to see how sweet everyone is when they’re reuniting!

31. Adrien says at the end that he’s not cut out to be Ladybug and honestly y’all... That’s okay. Adrien has his role and he’s incredibly good at his role, and Ladybug is incredibly good at hers. They’re both SATISFIED with their roles. He’s not upset when he says he’s not cut out to be Ladybug, not even a little. He very happily takes Plagg back and steps back into his usual territory. Again, he wasn’t bad at the ladybug miraculous. It just came with more to think about than he really wants to, things that Ladybug is very HAPPY to think about, and if their dynamic already works, then he’s perfectly happy to focus on his part and leave her job to her. That’s great!!!

32. Juleka getting to do the fashion shoot... Yay. :’D I just want good things for Juleka.

In conclusion, this episode is pure unbridled fun from start to finish. It’s chaotic, it’s got top tier banter, it’s a phenomenal change of pace from the rest of the series. I actually love watching this episode with folks for the first time because seeing the look of complete shock and glee on their face as Marinette grabs that cat ring from Plagg is just FUN! And at the end of the day, this episode is a statement on three things:

- Marinette is a talented girl. -Adrien is great at his job. - And ML as a show’s priority will always, first and foremost, be fun.

And none of those are a bad thing.

Hope you enjoyed the essay! :D

#miraculous ladybug #reflekdoll #marinette dupain cheng #adrien agreste #ladynoire #mister bug

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anticallouts · 4 years ago

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Question. does your idea of being anti-callouts also include folks of different belief systems that would involve, say, a much narrower view of sexual morality, or are they fair game to be called out as homophobes and all that just because of their beliefs, even if they’ve never actually displayed any kind of discriminatory behavior? Or what about those who sided with or even remotely supported trump or are from MAGA groups? Are they outside the scope of your anti-callout mission too? Asking cuz imo it’s hypocritical to say you’re anti-callouts but then think its ok for these folks to be ostracized and bullied cuz “they need to be held accountable” for beliefs that you don’t agree with and more often than not, don’t fully understand what they believe or why. And I’m not talking about stuff they said decades ago, I’m talking about present day stuff.

First, I will direct you back to this post, specifically the ending paragraph:

One important thing to internalize is that ignorance doesn’t make you a bad person. This goes for judging your own actions as well as others’. It’s okay to constantly be learning and adapting your behavior based on new information. If you find out from discourse that you had been using hurtful language or promoting a hurtful idea, it doesn’t mean you were secretly a bad person all along. It just means you didn’t know. In an ideal world, we would all be patient and forgiving with people who weren’t acting in bad faith, but unfortunately this is Tumblr. Just try to do your best, and take breaks if you need them.

The key point here is ‘in bad faith’. This blog, and the general disagreement in fandom re: callout culture, usually stems from the idea that it is bad to hold people with taste in unpopular fictional ships to the same standard as unrepentant abusers, pedophiles, racists, and homophobes. The point is not that those categories of people aren’t in themselves problematic, just that shippers shouldn’t get tacked on to that list for liking anime boy 1 and anime boy 2, nor should ANYONE get tacked onto that list based on rumors or anon messages if there is actually no evidence of wrongdoing.

We can debate until the cows come home about what ‘counts’ as bigotry and the right way to deal with microaggressions, but for this post (and because you mentioned MAGA and homophobic Christianity) I’m going to assume you’re talking about standard, run-of-the-mill bigotry. The kind you can look at and easily understand exactly why it is hurtful.

Being against callout culture is not the same thing as being against all callouts, all the time, for any reason. (I did not name this blog, I inherited it. I am now considering a revised URL if that is the impression this one gives.)

I am never going to defend a homophobe. I am never going to defend a racist. If someone comes to me with a tweet from a homophobe’s twitter acct that says ‘God says all lesbians are abominations but I’m not homophobic tho it’s just what the Bible says’ I’m not going to assume they’re an infant who doesn’t understand logic or empathy or critical thinking. I’m gonna block them. If they’re famous, I’m gonna show my friends and my friends are also gonna block them and also possibly talk shit about them on Twitter because they’re bajillionares and it doesn’t matter.

(Except really I encourage people not to do this - not because it’s morally wrong, but because they can use their much larger platform to harass you if they feel like it. See John Boyega’s behavior towards the women who were hurt by his misogynistic language as an example.)

Now, on a smaller scale, if they’re just a regular old member of a fandom? If it turns out everyone blocks them because they won’t stop talking about how much they hate the gays and Jews and SJWs and the fandom is full of gays and Jews and SJWs who don’t want to listen to it, that’s not ostracization, that’s quality control. No one gets to complain that other people won’t listen to their opinions, and that’s not what this blog is advocating for.

I am extremely pro-block. I block people for ALL KINDS of things. I see a comment in the notes of a post I do not vibe with? Block. Don’t care if that user has never spoken to me in my life. I am the arbiter of my fandom experience, as is everyone else.

Furthermore, I want to address what seems to me to be the core of your complaint here:

“... even if they’ve never actually displayed any kind of discriminatory behavior?”

See, this is a bit logically inconsistent and it makes me wonder if this ask was not sent in good faith, but rather to try and catch me in a ‘gotcha, so much for the tolerant left’ type of way.

If someone is not displaying any kind of discriminatory behavior, then they fall under the ‘don’t make baseless callouts’ protection. There’s no evidence of any wrongdoing, no victim, no crime. Thinking gay people are horrible is, like, wrong, but as long as they keep that to themselves when engaging with others, fine. However, the fact that someone is being called out for open homophobia or racism means that... Hm... how do I put this... they kind of are displaying discriminatory behavior, my dude.

If they’re 12 years old and repeating what their racist dad said or homophobic pastor said, then yeah, don’t harass them. Don’t harass anyone, actually, but I am not Fandom God and I don’t control the whims or ways of the internet denizens so I can’t really do anything about that. Harassment doesn’t actually accomplish anything and is a waste of energy. Report them if they’re breaking the TOS and move on. (See my pro-block stance above for the acceptable alternative. Blocking! It’s like Herd Immunity, for fandoms.)

But everyone else in the fandom space has a right to warn each other ‘hey, there’s a 12 year old over there with no filter and they’re super racist, here’s their tweets.’

If they’re an adult and they’re doing that? As you said, present day stuff? It is completely fair game for their tweets or posts to be catalogued and shared as proof that they are a clear and present danger to other people in the fandom. Racists and homophobes have this nasty little habit of attempting to hurt people they hate, fandom needs ways to self-regulate and keep itself safe from actual harmful bigots.

There’s also a lot to be said about expecting vulnerable members of the community to do all the work educating people who are actively being malicious towards them in the hope that one comment will break through their willful ignorance and show them the light of human decency and teach them how to be good people and decent fans. If someone feels bad that other people don’t like them because of their homophobic beliefs, it’s not the fandom’s job to take them under wing and teach them why homophobia is wrong. None of us came out the womb knowing how to treat people; if the majority of us could figure it out by cultural osmosis, so can our racist homophobic strawman here. Either by being told directly, or by seeing that bigots are not welcome and making the single necessary logical leap that maybe it’s because homophobia/racism/etc hurts people and no one else likes being hurt.

So, to break it down:

Private racists: not posting anything racist, not harassing poc in the fandom, how would you ever know? Gross, but ultimately harmless. Can’t do anything about them, hopefully they see enough posts about why racism is bad to finally change their ways.

Past racists: said some dumb racist shit in the past, apologized, aren’t currently doing anything racist? Leave them alone. Be thankful. Hope that other people look to them as an example in learning and humility and growth.

Active racists: do not deserve your pity or protection. Learn to treat other people with respect or get off the internet. Shed no tears when they end up blocked by 90% of the fandom and anyone else with a brain. Their ignorance does not supersede everyone else’s right to feel safe and welcome in a community. Much like with private racists, I hope they learn (with a more direct lesson) that no one likes racists or wants to hang out with them and if they want friends they should learn to treat others as human beings.

#mod fox #racism #homophobia #callout culture #responses

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true-intha-blu · 5 years ago

Text

I propose this simple Question

First: why I ask this. Since the infancy of the KH fandom all the way back from KH1, I noticed this simple trend one that picked up tremulously after kh2. No this has nothing to do with shipping. Also to note; I have genuine curiosity if anyone else notices this and this is from my perspective and experience with dealing with the Kingdom hearts fandom. Others may have very different accounts but others (that I have asked) have indeed noticed this as well in my own view. I am not aiming to stir up hate or discourse. I aim for peaceful fandoms. However, this subject is something I see no one ever addresses and well... maybe breaking a status quo or ‘unspoken rule’. I hope this can be a reasonable discussion where I can learn another perspective or some people may notice it and just go... “Oh yeah. That is a thing.” To which the question at hand. “Why does R*ku always have to be cool?”

(Disclaimer I do not hate this character. This question is not hateful. It is not anti or whatever. I mean exactly what I say. I will not be tagging this in the R*ku tab to prevent any misunderstandings. I ask others do the same. Anyone who reblogs this with hate is in no way associated with me.)

I will state the positive traits about R*ku. He has had the greatest character arc out of all the Kingdom Hearts Characters. A great redemption arc from his lowest to blooming into practically a whole new person in his own struggle against his KH1 self. He’s loyal to his friends. Smart. Gets along with Mickey and Yen Sid. Mellow. Saved Kairi and Sora. Knows what he has done. He’s honest and shares his concerns with others. Since KH2 he has always been trying to help Sora in the best of his ability. In acknowledgment of his misdeeds in CoM and Days is very good and we see a character who has genuinely f’d-up and his trying his best to move past that by helping his friends despite the limited resources offered to him. ^These are very good traits for a character to have. Any character. Besides his one time self in KH1, what else is there to him? What can be addressed as a flaw or criticism of him? (I approach characters as even though a character goes through a development arc, does not mean they are void of flaws. No one works like that. Not characters or actual people.) I say this. I love Sora and Vanitas in the Kingdom Hearts fandom. However, I am not afraid to draw them doing stupid or silly things and point out they have various of unfavorable flaws. Sora is utterly dense and I hate the fact how he was portrayed in DDD but I accept it and I will drag him along pointing out that fact. It is part of his character. He’s a dork (and not always in a good way). He impulsive and is kinda a mess of a human being. He's stubborn in the worse ways and volatile. Vanitas appears to be on the surface a straight up evil villain. As far as the games go, he is just utterly vile in his contempt for the characters and his actions have brought suffering and misery to various of characters. (though there may be other traits that could set for his own arc) (I still love them both) But note how none of these flaws listed above are ‘endearing’ or even remotely positive. They are problems, that hinder the characters and those around them. These are persistent traits even though both Sora and Vanitas have mellowed. Sora far more than Vanitas. I just do not see this done with R*ku. I rarely (they do exist but in comparison to the likes of Sora, Org XIII, even foretellers, or Roxas [who could be compared to be as “badass” as R*ku], its rarely ever there) I don’t see anyone talking about Riku doing dumb stuff. Being silly or being the butt of a joke or just not, not being good. Example of the latter: When there was talk about Sora cooking in KH3, rarely did I see that, ‘oh, Sora learns how to cook and becomes very good at it’ and most I see ‘R*ku is already a fabulous cook’.... what about Kairi? What about even Lea? Aqua? There is no mention of these other characters being good at cooking. R*ku is usually A.) always the cooler looking one, or must be made to look cooler and B.) always be the better or best at something. I know that is kinda the thing in KH, that R*ku is talented and gifted as a person. As for the coolness factor, Nomura does this as well. Sora gets a keyblade, R*ku gets an edgier cooler keyblade with more details. Riku gets the powers of both light and darkness. R*ku gets the Keyblade Master title. R*ku gets actual growth in his body. He gets the more competent companion (Mickey). I am not saying these things are detractions or upsetting, they are just there and be defacto, cooler than other characters. He becoming edgier and emo was a good play on Normura because back in early 2005′s people thought that was cool and hot. Silver hair is automatically an attractive trait and western audiences love a person with a muscled body like R*ku’s. I don’t blame fans for being appealed to his character. But I suppose I am getting off-topic. Why do fans keep feeling compelled to make R*ku perfect? When people make fanart of him like say a monster form or pirate outfit, they always make it more detailed, edgier or just cooler than anyone else who would be drawn that way. He always looks more impressive than an original canonical design when other characters are drawn or written in ways that are not as impressive or equally the same to a canonical design/form/power. Has the cool wolf animal companion or the cooler weapon, the more detailed designs etc etc Even Axel who is a badass assassin can be silly or dumb-looking. Heck, they even did that in games. They made Axel failed and acknowledge it. I see Aqua who is awesome in design and badass moments, be criticized for her flaws that persist and others who wish to see her have more moments of weakness even with what we have seen in 0.2 Xion who has had a great arc in Days (Character arcs don’t always have to be a positive development) doesn’t get the coolness factor. Roxas who is probably the second most popular character still is known as a goofy boy who thought he could fight heartless off with a stick. That’s hilarious. The most notable thing about R*ku recently that wasn’t cool or badass or edgy was his infamous “WHAT?” response to Mickey in Kh3. And that was one thing. Only really that. But how Mickey worded it, anyone would have done the same. And I noticed that people use what Mickey said “Aqua is like Sora’ is a way to poke fun at Sora by implying that Aqua is like a dense 15 year old. (Again these are just observations I have made over a decade worth watching the Kh fandom). In talks with other people who are Sora stans or other stans, there is nothing but a lot of talk about R*ku being really good about things. Being superior to Sora, or Kairi, or Aqua and Terra. Over Roxas. Giving Axel two keyblades is never done, but people have given two to R*ku. I get it, people who love characters like to do so much with them. I do the same. I just... never seem to regard the characters I love as perfect as others see R*ku. Also... I just don't see anyone criticizing him (I mean criticism in actual acknowledgment of his character and not hating on said character). Or taking about traits or flaws that are not endearing “He cares too much about his friends” is not really that bad of a flaw in consideration. A lot of people would prefer to have that over say... anger issues. What about the fact he falls back into following the orders of others or doesn’t often decide things for himself?... What about Minor flaws? I just never see them in regards to these characters. Alright, so these are my observations I have made over... 14+ years of watching this fandom. And I want to ask, why do fans see him as such? Besides the only reason being for them is “I like him.” Has it just become such a normal thing to make R*ku better? Is he really that good of a character than he is so universally loved? Or is the backlash of actually criticizing R*ku and seeing that maybe, making him too perfect is... not doing favors for him? An arc is just that, an arc. Doesn’t mean a character is perfect or done with. Doesn’t mean those flaws that persisted in him, are gone. Make your favorite character silly, or doing something very dumb (that does not even have to do with shipping), or put forth of what you would like to see improve in this character or express more about their flaws and their struggles. I love pointing out the negative traits in all my characters because I like seeing their struggle and how that makes them interact with new nuances in other characters. Maybe it's a running joke that R*ku is ‘Mr Perfect’ in the Kh fandom and I am just not seeing it. But it's daunting and just kinda rubs me the wrong way that all these characters in Kingdom Hearts have so many nuances to them and the one who has the best character arc so far in KH is regarded as... ‘Perfect’ I would like to know your opinion and if anyone else who is not a R*ku stan notice this, or is it just me and my own personal bias? (anything said above is in no way should ever be used to promote hate against R*ku or even bash him. In no way, I want to make others hate R*ku. I do not blame people who love this character to portray him in a superior way over everyone else. My address is that I just see this all the time. And I was wondering... why is it so widespread? Not even Axel who has a great redemption arc gets this.) (also another things is the whole sexgod R*ku that is also about however that may go into shipping and that I will not poke a stick at)

#kingdom hearts #character development #just a question #i wish to hear opinions #no bashing #no character hate #fuck antis #fuck character bashing #be mature people #positive and supportive enviroment

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